UK citizens say it is more important to support Ukraine than to maintain good relations with US, survey shows
Do you think it is more important for the UK government to support Ukraine or to maintain good relations with the US? | Daily Question
As an EU citizen, we want good relations with USA, It's 100% Trump and Musk who are ruining it.
They are literally insane, and USA needs to remove them. Unless they do, I guess we can't be friends anymore.
Half of the voters voted for Trump, so no thanks, I don't want to have good relations with the US. I want to isolate them as much as possible.
Half of the people who voted*
Trump got about the same number of votes this time as he did in the previous election (marginally less, I believe).
It makes little difference to point out, but it's good to remember that the Dems are a bunch of feckless corporate shills who lost the support of their voters, and about a third to half the country simply doesn't vote.
Trump is a symptom and the end result of deeply systemic and cultural issues here, and as an American, I hope you guys make it hurt. Maybe then we'll wake up to the problems here. I doubt it, but at least the economic collapse here will hopefully spare the rest of the world from a dementia patient with daddy Putin's leash on his collar swinging the biggest military budget in the world around like he's got something to compensate for.
Europeans are still clinging to the delusion that Trump is an aberration.
You are right, the problem is very much a widespread attitude in USA.
They need to modernize their democracy, and they need to modernize their interpretation and regulation of what free speech is.
The 2 main reasons USA is as fucked up as it is now, is that the 2 party system undermines democracy, and way too much misinformation is allowed.
You can't build democracy on lies.
I really really hope Americans will wake up soon, and realize this.
Only 1/3 of eligible voters voted for Trump. That’s what makes it even worse. 1/3 didn’t even fucking vote.
As an American, yeah that’s the right choice.
It also needs to be said that you probably can’t remain on good terms with the US, given the current regime and their “negotiation tactics”.
We can only hope that in four years you let us earn your trust back
Removing them isn't enough. Over 77 million people saw his previous term, looked at him now, and said "Yep! I want more of that!" And the media being complicit doesn't help, either.
I absolutely agree, American democracy seriously needs to be reformed, as it is it is at best a dysfunctional democracy. And I think the evidence should be very clear on that now.
as an american we want good government but it's the billionaire oligarchs who are ruining it
And misinformation. That's how they get and hold power. Like what happened here in Ohio with the gerrymandering.
Only because the people allow it.
I know nobody can change that alone, but USA need to friggin get some graasroot movements going to get real democracy, and elect politicians that don't prioritize only the 1%.
The 2 party system simply doesn't work.
Gonna be honest, i haven't agreed with that in 20 years, on account that the US can and will fuck over any ally it has if that has the slightest marginal gain for them. Any time the wind blows a different way, the US will throw all their allies under the bus. They are a greedy nation and poor allies.
They've spied on the EU, they applied tariffs on the EU, they have threatened the EU with invasion after we helped them in their fruitless war in the middle east and had to deal with the migrant crises that resulted from it basically alone ? Now we have to deal with meddling in democratic elections? Never again, i say. We go at it alone, we trade, but that's it.
They are a greedy nation and poor allies.
They were great help when Yugoslavia broke down.
They were also great help, although with some hold backs to help Ukraine, it's absolutely nonsense to say otherwise.
The basis for the Europe-USA friendship is also that USA helped enormously way beyond any European country's ability in WW2. And the Americans actually secured freedom for western Europe, very contrary to the part that Soviet Union occupied.
USA was also great aid for Europe when the Soviet collapsed, making for instance Poland one of the countries where USA was most popular after that.
Unfortunately cracks began to appear already with Bush Jr. and the false intelligence on Iraq. And obviously under Trump who threatened to not respect article 5. And obviously now where Trump behaves like a mafia boss.
But there is no doubt we'd prefer normal relations restored, where USA and allies cooperate on real issues around the world.
Unfortunately Trump makes normal relations impossible.
It available to anyone who does exactly are they are told .
Musk and Trump don’t change that.
Even if you are right, there's a huge difference between what Trump is asking, and what normal presidents ask of you to be friends.
Being friends is supposed to be a 2 way relationship, but with Trump it's not.
17hr account throwing around shit.
The simple reality is that it is not possible to maintain good relations with the US. Donald Trump is an idiot and a fascist whose agenda is driven by his whims as much as anything else. Starmer could bend over backwards to appease His Orange Majesty on every issue and Trump would still fuck the UK just because.
I wouldn't say it's just more important, I'd say it's a moral imperative to support Ukraine's fight for it's sovereign land over keeping buddy-buddy with a government running rampant with corruption and Russian puppetry
Agreed. I would rather the UK have fewer allies of a higher moral calibre than play sycophant to a fascist cabal of degenerates.
As a Canadian you can't trust anything coming out of the Musk /Trump White House. Us in Canada no longer consider them friends.
They're threatening daily to take Canada by whatever means necessary. That's not an ally, that's a threat. Canada needs to protect itself, and the British people are quite right to back Ukraine. Trump is working with Putin to hand Ukraine to Russia. Russia will not stop its ambitions there and it is a threat to all of Europe.
Yesterday Trump threatened to pull US troops out of Europe if the EU did not agree to his and Putin's plan for Ukraine. It's a very clear threat: give Ukraine to Russia or we give you to Russia. Of course the USA in its current state would not defend Europe anyway. To me it looks like the plan is for Trump to seize Canada, Greenland, Panama, etc., while Putin grabs as much of Europe as he can.
Under these conditions what is NATO? Trump is deliberately destroying it.
So the UK, Canada and Europe need to stand firm against the alliance of the USA, Russia and those European countries that have gone over to fascism. The very existence of our countries is at stake.
And watch out for the far right at home, in the UK, Canada and Europe. Their loyalties do not lie with their countries, and they're being bankrolled and supported by powerful people internationally.
Under these conditions what is NATO?
Already-preexisting integration of most EU armies (and the rest aren't completely out of the loop) as well as Canada Turkey, Norway, and Iceland.
The long and short of it is if the US should bail out of NATO what is left is an absolute behemoth of a force with severe shortcomings in power projection and strategic airlift capacity. The latter only until Ukraine is admitted they have Antonov. Not sure whether we want much power projection but the lift capacity is a shortfall. On the upside we have more than enough stealth subs to stop others from projecting with aircraft carriers.
From the US side, strategically, this is just a self-inflicted wound: There's a couple of US soldiers in Europe as part of tripwire forces, relevant politically but not in combat terms, the rest is there to project force into the middle east. They'd be giving that up, I wonder what Israel thinks of that. The US would not have been capable to do Iraq or Afghanistan without European bases.
They're right too. The US has the luxury of turning a blind eye. The UK and Europe does not.
As they always do. It's easy to build your "great" empire if all your wars and enemies are far away.
I can't believe we're betraying Ukraine for no reason.
Oh wait... Actually I can believe it, i knew it was going to happen, and I voted against it.
It's not for no reason, it's to make Putin happier, maybe extort a bunch of mineral rights out of Ukraine. See, plenty of reason...
Sure, you're right about that. I should have said no good reason.
Am UK citizen, can confirm.
American here and I agree. Our government is a disaster right now so it's better to focus on something actionable, like defeating Putin.
your government are all nazis. and half of your population are fascists. we (ukraine and eu) can’t trust you, and hopefully we will learn from it this time.
How dare you lob facts at us as if they're insults...
the NAZIs actually based some of thier systems on the americans racist policies, like segegation and what not. and we never actually eradicated our nazis sympathesizers from the 40s, they just passed it on to the next gen and the next after that.
American here: no objections whatsoever. This is the correct answer. Our government is a bag of dicks, and a lot of us hate it too.
Am American, 1000% agree.
I think the UK can use this as an opportunity to improve relations with the EU, or to at least get a trade partner in Ukraine and to take a chunk of Russian assets. You get to be a good guy, and get rich by confiscating Putin's coffers.
Seriously, send in troops, and maybe the navy if Turkey permits. Do what American't.
Ask Turkey if they want to join in again for some Crimean War II? We killed a bunch of Russians before, why not again.
Half of our military bases are occupied by the Americans and we need your permission to do anything.
With a little luck the orange shitler will withdraw troops from Europe (yeah, no, I don't dare to dream)
A heart breaking romance.
"Hey US, I think we should take a break. It's not me, it's you... I know you've been cheating on me with Putin"
Coming soon to a theater near you.
Still a better love story than...
Actually, no, it's not.
American. Ashamed to say that i briefly thought, "maybe zelenaky can save us" - like he doesn't have enough going on! We desperately need for someone strong and charismatic to stand up to orange Jesus!
We had that chance. We picked Biden instead. Now it's "find out" time.
Am US citizen living in the UK. Can confirm.
Am UK citizen living in US. Halp.
Happy to send you branstons pickle or Cadbury or something to ease your anxiety, though.
Idk why you think me of all people is gonna help you lol. I’m not trading places. No take backsies! Find a Farage supporter and ask them!
Ha! Imagine western nations listening to their citizens instead of their rulers.
Contrary to countries in the East where they have all the freedoms, like, say, China? Russia?
What are you trying to say exactly?
We should be better than that.
Every country has to wrestle with their own form of oligarchy. There is always a subgroup of power hungry individuals that want to be ruling the kingdom.
I mean yeah, makes sense. Russia is a direct threat to us all. Fuck the US if they think their egg prices are more important than European security and not having dictators have their ways.
Obviously. But what if you can only support Ukraine by maintaining good relations with the US?
Uk citizens voted to leave the European Union and probably couldn’t find Ukraine on a map.
There is no point, literally no point asking them such questions, unless ….oh yah, the government is manufacturing consent for more money Ukraine, while telling its citizens there is no money for schools.
What a pointless take on the situation. You’ve added nothing of value.
This account (that you responded to) was created a mere few hours ago. It might even have been created purely to troll people, possibly by someone who has gotten used to being banned using a recognizable account name.
On PieFed I find it very helpful to see an icon next to people's names indicating brand-new accounts. Some Lemmy apps can do that as well (I switched over to Voyager here to see if it would, but nope, at least not by default). Anyway I wanted to point out that it is a very useful feature, for exactly such scenarios as this!
Are you from the UK?
Less than a day old account. Troll.
Confirmed. British people are low information voters and easily manipulated. See also voting for Boris Johnson
British values on display here, it's not even marginal (48% for Ukraine vs 20% for Trump's America).
It's not often I'm proud of my country these days, but this is one of those rare moments.
Agreed. And hopefully our man Kier can stop cosplaying long enough to follow through on more military support.
I'm worried about the 32% abstaining / having no opinion, though.
I don't know how the survey was done but if it's like a phone survey I would imagine that a lot of people would answer "I don't care" to whatever the question is. They just don't care about answering a phone survey.
There's always some percentage of people who are ignorant of global issues and want to stay out of things... You'd think they were Farage voters but actually they usually don't vote