How is it that "protecting basic democracy and the rule of law, and not crowning a criminal dictator" wasn't even on the chart?!
Why is there such an obsession with immigration?
Do you want to pick strawberries? It's back-breaking and sucks.
E: thanks for all the replies. I wrote this while pissed about the results, it was supposed to be rhetorical.
At this point, work on helping immigrant friends and neighbors however you can, whether by helping with immigration paperwork or "other"methodologies.
If you need a scapegoat, you pick one that can't defend itself as easy.
The obsession is because that's the news friendly way of answering with "racism".
This was what the UK discovered after Brexit
Turns out, if you kick out all the polish nurses and restaurant workers, you suddenly don’t have enough staff in those places. Who would have thought.
Other than that, everything worked out perfectly. Oh, but then there’s also the Northern Ireland border. Well other than those two issues… actually, there are quite a few issues, but that’s besides the point. It’s been smooth sailing ever since, everyone is happy, it’s never been better.
Thinking back to the one debate he had with Harris, Trump blathered nonstop about immigration. He talks about it like a wave of moorish invaders sweeping across the land, pillaging. This is obviously a powerful Image if you can get people to believe it. And in some areas people have been feeling like American culture is giving way to Mexican culture as the population in their home towns shifts, so Trump’s rhetoric taps into something that was already there. And if we’re honest, border policy is a weird zone where many of the laws don’t make intuitive sense. America talks out of both sides of its mouth on the issue, historically. A lot of people are here illegally whom we depend on utterly to staff our economy. So their presence is in some way sanctioned, tolerated, but not fully legitimized in law. When someone comes along and articulates one clear direction on immigration, it sounds like someone is speaking clearly for the first time. Even if that direction is stupid, hateful, xenophobic, and economically unviable.
I hear what you're saying. What boring people to be afraid of novel cultures.
Anyway, fine, close the border and make it so only US citizens can do all the labor nobody wants to do. Watch how much doesn't get done; the economics behind work and such don't change rapidly. I'll bet most small farmers get destroyed with fields full of rotting, previously ready to harvest crops because nobody can offer a citizen enough to do the work, in a way that still yields a profit.
The billionaires with factory farms and prison labor will likely win out again.
They’re convenient scapegoats that can’t defend themselves. “Look, it’s a witch! Burn it”
Never liked that argument. It's essentially "Why, don't you like immigration, dummy? Don't you know immigrants are easily exploited to do hard labour cheaply?"
I'm not saying it isn't true, especially in the west, but in my eyes, there are much more moral arguments for immigration.
Conservatives don’t care about that sort of morals. They only care about what affects them directly. Maybe that means they can’t find tomatoes or apples one day. Then they’ll blame some Democrat for the problem.
I agree that it's low-hanging... nope. Bailing on that one.
I do think quality farm work is critical for our health as a nation, and I don't mean economically.
Can we automate it? Maybe. Till then, someone's gotta do it, and for those who go into it, there's gotta be a floor on job quality, seemingly basic things like bathroom and water breaks.
Race stuff gets clicks and views
No, I don't think you understand it fully. That's what the legal minorities and children are for. Ask rural folk over 60 if they had a job as a child and you'll got a Lt of answers like "I worked picking tomatoes when I was 10."
The rich get to go to private school, the poor get to sell their children off to robber barons. You would not believe how many parents out there are eager for this too. A good portion of the GOP are abusers that dont really care about their children and if they can force their children to go out and get a job so they can take their paychecks, they will.
That's why they are pro-birth and anti-education. This is why we still dont have year-round schooling because "traditionalists" want to be able to make use of child labor.
If you dont think it is coming, almost every red state has attemptdd to repeal their states child labor laws for agricultural and factory work.
I admittedly can't imagine people wanting such a thing. They really are of a different fabric it seems, hurt people hurting people. I guess all the rest of us can do is support letting people know there's another option and helping them escape that trap if desired.
They don't want to live like us, fostering the mind over breaking down the body. So be it, I guess.
Why? Because the right was harping on it. So the news covers it. And then “people are talking about it.” And in 2024, that means everyone has to have an opinion it. The right has perfected the weaponization of communication. Fascists are good at that, historically.
Here comes the Democrats again. Complaining that their slaves are being taken away.
That was Florida in recent history, not the dems. “uhh can you latinos come back and work for us again?? no one is filling these jobs as you leave due to the recent legislative hatefest”
Conservatives don’t realize they have slaves, let alone rely on them. They pound the table about migrants while paying someone employing them to mow their lawn or renovate their house. Press them about it and they always tell you it’s none of their business how the people they contract keep the prices down.
Shut the fuck up moron. I absolutely want immigrant workers to have protections against being exploited, to be paid fairly and to be able to help us do work if they want to do it.
Having a bathroom nearby where they're working? Not previously guaranteed. Think about what a poor idea that potentially is for the food you're putting in your mouth.
What a limp-brained take.
Apparently I can't curse at you & your low energy understanding of the world, last comment removed.
I stand by what I said before, I believe all workers should be paid fairly, have access to things like bathrooms & water, and be able to easily come and go as they need & desire.
Try getting better nutrition, it'll help with your energy problem.
I think we have to accept that the American electorate actually wants fascism.
It's more that Harris did such a terrible job that even the other side being literal Hitler didn't save her.
Let's give them leftist fascism and see how they react.
I love how Economy is a high priority, yet they voted for the asshole known being the genius behind several bankruptcies. "The economy isn't doing good, clearly we need someone who can fuck shit up to make it work!"
Unironically, I think that was the thought process.
Hard to vote for someone who is telling you all is well and the people that got the country here are competent and mean well, when the country is going through 5 different crises, all preventing you from living a decent life.
The American electorate:
Economy? Ah yes, let's elect the person that wants to put 100% sanctions on literally everything. Masterful gambit sirs. Ya'll can rot in hell!
Also side note, America's economy is held up by cheap immigrant labor, so way to double dunk.
The news says the Republicans are better at [the economy] because they are. How are they better. Because they are better for the economy. Who crashed the economy the last four times it's happened Republicans. They're so good at economy!
They're never around for the rebound though. They leave the Democrats to pick up the pieces and the stupid fucks that voted for trump only see that gas was cheaper 5 years ago, so that must mean that trump's economy was better!
Also, I love how no one gives a shit about the ecological apocalypse. This is why I kept telling you guys: let the hurricanes destroy everything. No more FEMA. Americans clearly don’t care.
Economy
This is Trump's economy, you idiots. This is the fallout from his incompetence and malice. But heaven forbid voters understand basic principles which rule their lives.
i think you give too much credit to Trump. the economy has been rigged against the working class for a long time. it's just getting progressively more brutal which makes people feel increasingly insecure.
an insecure working class elects strongmen who promise simple solutions
The best, simplest summation I've seen. Thank you. I've been searching for something to make sense of it and this is definitely it. Being forced into voting for the "least worst" candidate obscures where that path is headed by either candidate.
It's the pattern in American politics that has existed since I was born: Republicans fuck the economy, Democrats do their best to fix it, people blame the Democrats for the bad economy and elect Republicans who fuck it up even more.
No, sorry, but you don't get to say that four years later.
The economy got trashed in his last year... but remember how the sparse economic relief that were carried through the democratic congress got completely wiped out as soon as Biden took office? When the democrats took away the child tax credit childhood poverty doubled overnight. And you may say the cause of the inflation was Trump's mismanagement (And it wasn't. The supply chain breakdown would have happened no matter who was in office.) what was the democratic response? Fucking Chicago school.
What's happening is the US empire is not so slowly rotting and material conditions are deteriorating. That's independent of what party is in power. But both parties are wedded to capital. And voters are hopping from one foot to the other while standing on that hot skillet trying to find relief. You're not going to find it without overthrowing capitalism. This is the barbarism we were warning you about.
And it wasn’t. The supply chain breakdown would have happened no matter who was in office
if i remember correctly, COVID brought our inflation up to roughly 6%. then the Ukrainian war took it the rest of way where it peaked near 9% (over 10% in my home state)
these things would have happened anyway, although choosing to prolong the Ukrainian war as long as possible most definitely increased inflation. people think we only gave 2 or 3 hundred billion, but realistically the American public has paid more than a trillion in the invisible tax that is inflation. hundreds of thousands of layoffs because of higher interest rates are also connected to this
Worse: Congress purposely intended for the president to not have direct control over the economy.
Right, but the administration's actions typically get attributed to the president, plus the president does have a measure of control through executive orders, or proposals which get carried through the house and Senate. The president will obviously sign any initiative that they themselves proposed.
Racism less important, immigration more important.. that's interesting..
Blame the news media. They sane washed Trump.
Nah they wouldn't shut up about him til the point it got numb. Maybe they should have focused on Kamala instead.
Another thing that's barely on the chart: Foreign Policy, some fraction of which would be the genocide.
It just wasn't the influential issue that much of Lemmy wished it were, and clearly not the reason Harris lost.
Exactly. For all the talk of the Palestine/Israel genocide being a reason people didn't vote Harris, this poll certainly makes it seem like less of the issue. What the fuck happened? I'm genuinely ashamed to live in the States.
What the fuck happened?
Four years of a milquetoast, centrist Democrat telling the American people what they're living isn't the actual reality of the situation. Biden's admin kept rolling out the "soft landing, economy is doing great," schtick despite numerous news outlets reporting Americans don't feel like it's an economy working for them.
Then that Democrat finally stepping aside, too late for his constituents to have a say in who they want representing them. And then she ran on a centrist, return-to-the-status-quo platform that didn't inspire the majority of Americans, who are so apathetic based on decades of being ignored by politicians they just don't vote. Because what's the point?
Remember that people who considered foreign policy (aka Gaza) to be the most important didn't vote. People who voted Harris did so because they either thought some other issue was more important or just didn't care. I think you'll get better insights from a "why didn't you vote" survey. That said it's definitely not the only reason Harris lost; it was her complete and utter failure at campaigning that allowed Trump to go around collecting swing states like they're fucking MTG cards.
Foreign policy isn't important to the workers, doing political work in my local area people will sooner talk about the dog shit sproon around theyre street or litter, the closure of public toilets or the removal of public bins as they all have a noticeable and tangible effect on day to day life. Sadly Gaza isn't a broad issue to none gazans. I'm not advocating for this behaviour btw, just pointing out what I've noticed and spoken about in political circles.
99.9% of US voters wouldn't even be there if it wasn't for genocide
It's simple, and history has borne this out many many times.
In a bad economy, no one cares about your politics if you're the candidate of change. There's a reason why Harris spent two months repeating memes instead of defending Biden's policies, because it's impossible to defend the fact that you had four years to rule and there are more people working 2-3 jobs just to survive.
They knew they needed to appeal to workers. Instead, they spent most of the campaign repeating this meaningless platitude about joy to people who are being worked to death.
In a bad economy, no one cares about your politics
That's no excuse for electing someone whose stated policies and politics will fuck the economy even further and faster.
Sure it is, if you don't understand economics, which few Merkins do. The evidence is right in front of us.
Also, there were plenty of people who were never going to vote for a woman, no matter what.
I'm sure that's true too, but that's not the reason she lost, and Democrats will continue to stack losses if that's the narrative that they go with.
Democrats haven't been ceding male voters to Republicans for 16 years because they hate women. It's because, in the liberal and activist communities, it's become customary and accepted to treat men like shit.
Plenty of people will also never vote for a black man, but that worked spectacularly for the Democrats the first time.
Don’t forget immigrants who hate immigrants.
Then maybe don't force a woman onto the ballot in "the most important election of our lifetime". I'm all for progress, but you don't win elections by forcing ideals upon people who won't have them, and if this was truly the most important election of our lifetime, then the Democrats should have fielded their most appealing candidate.
If that's why Kamala lost, then explain why Tammy Baldwin is winning Wisconsin and Elissa Slotkin is winning in Michigan.
Healthcare: 8%
That explains why americans in America are provided with less(no at all) healthcare than american tourisis in fucking Russia.
This is what happens if any foreigner for example breaks bone in Russia:
- Emergency, including emergency specialized, medical care is provided to foreign citizens in case of sickness, accident, trauma, poisining and other cases requireing emergency treatment. Such medical treatment provided by state and municipal healthcare organizations is free of charge.
You don't win an election just with vibes.
Kamala didn't bring as much substance as what the left electorate was expecting from her, and couldn't differentiate herself from Biden and the current term she is serving under. The whole democratic party went under because all they promise is vibes compared the current economical struggles people are facing.
The truth is the dems are a right wing party now, they've been dragged there by the rethugs.. and people Want to vote for an Actual left wing party, but there literally isnt one in the US.
The dems were never left wing in international standards. otherwise you would already have had universal health care.
I don't think people want to vote for a party. People want to vote for someone who's making sense for them, and looks like for majority it was Trump this time.
An "actual left wing party" must not only have ideology, but a sound plan on how to improve people's lives and an ability to communicate this plan to people, loud and clear. Actually, as populists are now trusted everywhere in the world, the plan is less important than communication
I was onboard with her but I honestly felt icky every time the Biden administration released a new statement about how good the economy is. How out of touch do you have to be to think the economy is good? Republicans have no intention of fixing that but at least they're smart enough to see that people feel crushed in this economy and pander to it. And apparently that was a much bigger issue than abortion, which shocked me at first but as it settles I see that my fear as a woman pales in comparison to America's fear of a woman and America's struggling financial situation.
How out of touch do you have to be to think the economy is good?
Liberals measure the health of the economy by Gross Domestic Product (which has been going up), and Consumer Price Index (which includes big-screen TVs). You'd have to dismantle everything they paid to learn in college econ.
"It's easier to fool people than to convince them that they have been fooled."
Immigration is such a horseshit issue. Why are people dumb enough to fall for this shit?
Immigration will be "solved" come January, but not because Trump will actually do anything about it, but he'll just say the problem is solved and then stop talking about it.
Because the Democrats picked it up and used it as an issue as well. Instead of dispelling the myths of "Bigrant Crime," as if that would be a challenge, they took an anti-immigration stance as well. Honestly, Trump had a rare master class attack on the Dems with the whole "they've been in power for four years, why haven't they already done everything," because it called out just how shallow the Dems bending to conservative anti-immigrant policy was. It was almost certainly an accident on his part, especially since his party was the reason Dems couldn't be as hard on immigration as they wanted, but it turned into effective messaging.
It will be solved because nobody with any intelligence will actually pick the USA over any of the other countries that offer asylum after January
Thank you, Knee Tits.
very welcome! Its worth nothing Im not very good at percentages...
Honestly, I hope Trump and his republican dumb fucks go through with their tariff plan to "save" the much improved economy. Americans deserve it.
Americans deserve everything that is about to happen.
I wanted Bernie some years ago but also believe that we deserve this.
Because too many people are selfish and think that things are bad so might as well make them worse.
They forgot the most important thing: Lead poisoning
Ironically Republican presidents are the worst for the economy, https://www.jec.senate.gov/public/index.cfm/democrats/2024/10/the-u-s-economy-performs-better-under-democratic-presidents
Wait... This chart is hard to read. This chart is ... "how much more important these issues are to people as a percentage, than they were as a percentage in 2020?"
really? I must be reading this wrong
It's just straight percent of voters I think. Then they're sorted left to right based on how important they were in 2020.
When the most important is something that isn't even real.....gj America. Fools.
Immigration isn’t real?
If I have to spell it out for the slow folks "immigration"="border crisis".
Happy to help!
I don’t think those were choices on the exit poll😂
That they weren't is why statistics are lies.
It's always about the economy. Every election period.
The economy is actually great. Most people just don't have the brains to understand why when they feel like it isn't. Sentiment is king.
This is the kind of out of touch thinking that is why Harris lost.
It literally doesn’t matter how great the economy is if people are struggling, and they are.
No one gives a shit about how much the GDP grew, they can about the price of eggs and milk.
Harris repeated biden saying the economy is great and ignored that there are people struggling and focusing in on messaging to help them.
I know her policies might have helped the average American, but no one reads policies anymore, unfortunately.
I’m a Harris voter.
racism should be represented across the board
Or Nuclear arsenel. The reason is that it wasn't mentioned at the debates.
It's mind boggling...
Site your source. Downvoted. Don't post without a link in the future
#Owned
cite
Lmao liberals downvoting you for daring to think sums up the 2024 election pretty good
It's neither "their" problem not one that was manufactured and shoved down throats
I would assume the answer to your question is "this data sucks"
I guess this just goes to show what everyone is saying.
The left is shooting themselves in the foot. People care about immigration and the left won't solve it. So they lose power, that's democracy in action.
If the left want wants they need to listen to the concerns of the people.
People care about their economic well-being (which "the immigrants" are just scapegoats for) and the liberals abjectly refuse to do anything about that.
But that still doesn't excuse anybody flushing the rule of law down the toilet.
But that still doesn't excuse anybody flushing the rule of law down the toilet.
Did i say it did?
People obviously care note about immigration than that. That's how high of a priority it is I guess.
Which aspects of immigration are harming you?
Lack of cultural integration, homophobia, sexism, racism, religion, lack of local training and development, lack of capital investment, high housing costs, poor housing quality, wage suppression, increasing density of the country, crime, making places less desirable and more crime ridden.
But no one ever wants to talk about anything that isn't short term averages.
I haven't got an issue with immigration as a concept or necessarily as an average.
But there is a reason no one complains about first, second, third generation Australians coming to their country not learning the language, not integrating, committing crimes and no treating women right. A lot of people on the left live in outright denial about immigration.
Sure keep the upper class happy by keeping wages down and house prices high. Only costs you money, safety and community.
Not that you're wrong with your conclusion, but you picked a bad issue to go on. Democrats won't solve immigration because there's nothing to solve. Immigrants are not committing crimes at a higher rate than the rest of the population, and while America gets a lot of migrants, we also have a collapsing birthrate and need a growing populace for infinite shareholder growth.
The problem is that Republicans keep making up lies about immigration, even nonsensical lies like "they're eating the dogs," and the Democrats do nothing to dispel these lies. They don't sit down with the charts that verifiably disprove the Republican bullshit. Instead, they pick it up, and promise they'll be tougher on immigration next time, giving legitimacy to the lies.
Immigration is lost in the short term averages at the least. It needs breaking down and calculating out over lifetimes.
Because democracy and the basic rule of law will be fine.
He's literally said that people "won't have to worry about voting" once he's in power. Sounds like a direct threat to democracy, no?
