At least one society is decent enough to take out their antisocial billionaire parasite trash...
Good thing we (the US) lost the war, or this lady would probably have her own team of lobbyists running their country.
While celebrating a billionaire getting their just desserts is always fun, not really sure that this is a reflection of the decency of the Vietnamese government.
Since there's no rational hope of addressing the other 3k or so billionaire parasites on Earth without building a really big Titanic wreckage tour sub and making little paths of stock certificates leading to it like reese's pieces in ET, I'll take whatever incidental vicarious revenge against humanity's oppressors I can get.
I can't get behind a government giving the death penalty to anybody for any reason
Since when is it leftist to support the death penalty, let alone take glee in it. This is like the boomer FB shit
I'm against the death penalty in general, but I also acknowledge that in terms of tangible damage to humanity, any billionaire walking the Earth makes any serial killer who has ever walked the Earth seem positively quaint by scale.
I also recognize that we are living under class occupation. The owner class handily won the class war by convincing most of the developed world not to fight it half a century ago.
The peasants don't have the luxury of taking prisoners. We are the losers of a war, in spite of the fact that many have come to worship their occupying oppressors.
Keeping the most destructive humans locked away and well fed until they die of natural causes is a peacetime luxury for those in charge, and unless you're holding a reprehensible amount of capital, that isn't us. You might believe we are in peacetime, but if we refuse to stop them, and it looks that way, they will force our shared, communal habitat to stop us all through their insatiable, sociopathic avarice.
We love to think we're not, but we're still subjects wholly dependant on this world, even the owners activily attacking us and it simultaneously.
well fucking said.
The French revolution shows that the guilotines don't necessarily stop when the aristocrats are all dead. I'm not enthusiastic about mob justice
The peasants don’t have the luxury of taking prisoners.
I mean, why not? POWs have their own self-evident advantages, as we've seen taking place in palestine right now. Hostages are a pretty good thing to have if you want to create a long term negotiating strategy with other people.
But also, if you get rid of the billioinaire's billions, then you get rid of the billionaire. Now you just have a 'naire. Maybe a thousandaire, or something. Like, all the rich people that fled from cuba to florida didn't really end up doing a whole lot with their lives except being mad and super bitter about the fact that they weren't able to keep participating in a fascist government that oppressed the people. Most of them were petite bourgeois anyways. It's the ones that refused to leave that you end up murdering by way of this being the only thing that can force them to leave.
None of that is really similar to this situation at all, even, this is just an independent government killing someone that realistically could have no recourse if they were just completely stripped of their money and sent off to go fuck around in some other country. It's also, to me, kind of an illustration of the divide that you conceive of prison as a "way to keep the most destructive humans locked away and well fed until they die of natural causes". There's, ideally, a greater purpose to prison beyond that. You're justifying this by conceiving of this as like, a "war", an extreme war, a life or death war, oooh it's a war, wartime wartime wartime, but then, the police do the same thing when they justify shooting some guy on the street.
I dunno, this strikes me as a lot of nice sounding guilt-assuaging talk, as good rhetoric, but you haven't really given me any logical argumentation to chew on here, as to why this would be good or why this had to be done, really.
It is perfectly reasonable to oppose the death penalty, but the foundational event of the modern left movement was people chopping off a king's head.
I'm against the death penalty on the grounds that I don't want the government to have the authority to kill because they keep fucking it up. Either they get the wrong person or botch the execution.
There's no question that a person is a billionaire.
Since you can't make a revolution with white gloves.
The term "leftist" is too broad and "death penalty" too loosely defined.
Auth-leftists definitely support the death penalty, as in a powerful state should have authority to kill.
Anarchists don't think there should be a state therefore there is no body authorized to kill. If someone must die, it would be at the hands of an individual or an ad-hoc grouping and be called "self-defense".
Thinking things can change without the 0.1% being killed at all is a liberal idea.
This is like the boomer FB shit
Welcome to Lemmy!
You can put me in whatever category you like. I still want to see the 1% hang.
People are extremely bitter that rich people exist, and openly would call for their deaths, regardless of however much their lives would actually improve, were they to die, or however much their oppression might continue under a more conventional arrangement, or a less, sort of, offensive level of wealth inequality. People do find it offensive, basically, they find it ostentatious, and what's more commonly called for, to be put to death, than ostentatiousness? Than the offense of sensibilities?
I dunno. You get a lot of hard talk from supposed leftists who understand nothing of the kind of core principles at play, but none of them will realistically do anything, they're just floating by and passively regurgitating whatever they consume in the spectacle. They lack the empathy to commit real violence or change, I think.
They lack the empathy to commit real violence
The poor aren't strong enough to kill. That's why I have to. New Batman villain was just created.
It always stops at the death of the rich. The money they have doesn't magically go into the public coffers to be distributed for the benefit of those who need it. It's all just grievance and schadenfreude rather than a way to change up the structure of power.
Interesting if you read about it, while many were found guilty I think only a woman is being sentences to death while many men are just getting a decade in prison for their involvement in it.
If she was the ringleader, sure... I guess (not that it makes the state's murdering of folks alright). But odd that she gets death while all the men don't even get 20 in jail.
I don't think we should have billionaires but celebrating state sponsored murder is fucking gross
Lol too bad. Eat the rich
/s ?
But that's the only murder that's socially acceptable!
I wish it were...
Normalize killing billionaires! (for legal reasons this is a joke)
You forgot war
“We” isn’t this the case of other billionaires getting mad at one billionaire?
Maybe we can trigger a feeding frenzy...
Not a fan of the death penalty
Me neither, but killing some of the capitalist class has always been part of leftist revolutions so I can let this one slide.
I don't think the state having the power to round people up and kill them, even if I don't like the people it is being done to. It seems really dangerous.
Me neither. Except in cases where I support it.
Seems like a waste of energy and labor. Put that capitalist pig to work in the community. I read somewhere that the death penalty is just a scare tactic to get her to give up some cash she’s got hidden.
I mean, Vietnam is a Socialist Oriented Market Economy.
86% of Vietnamese people own their own homes, 70% are farmers because the government will allocate farm land to anyone who proves they can raise crops.
Pretty impressive stats you got there, considering that 27.2% of Vietnamese people are under 18 years old.
And remember kids, 73% of all statistics are made up on the spot.
Gotta serve those numbers with some sauce
Fairly easy to find looks like home ownership rose to 88.1%
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_home_ownership_rate
The 70% farming statistics is quite wide spread;
https://www.google.com/search?q=70%25+of+veitname+are+farmers&oe=utf-8
Is that 70% of total or 70% of the homeowners?
70% of the rural population apparently:
https://www.google.com/search?q=70%25+of+veitname+are+farmers&oe=utf-8
That's actually pretty awesome IMO.
Cue 'that guy' telling me how bad Vietnam is.
Vietnam is actually really good, as far as middle-income countries without functional democracy go.
But a high proportion of the workforce engaged in agriculture is not a good thing. Though I don't think that 70% number is correct regardless. I think it's considerably lower (which is better for Vietnam).
Wake me up when Trump sees even just a shred of accountability, or Musk, or Bezos, or ....
She stole 12.5 billion dollars?!
Jesus Christ. How much is enough?
Also how does it get to 12.5 billion before people do something? Had they intervened with something less severe at 1 billion then there would still be 11.5 billion and a life not lost.
This is a communist country and a show trial for someone fell out of favor, not am actual fraud case
What will the method of execution be? A guillotine seems fitting.
trip to a coal mine would also be classic.
Anything that works, really.
That's typical communist competitor purges, it has nothing to o with redistribution of wealth.
I have neither the emotional nor mental bandwidth to read up on this, too stressed being poor. Does anything say what is happening to the money?
it doesn't have the money anymore, and that's why its being given justice.
thank you Vietnam, score one for the tankies. I mean, it took a while, and they still have billionaires, but its not nothing, so good on em if they follow through.
According to my quick Google search, there are about 100 million people in Vietnam. The average wage is $150 per month. $12.5B shared among each person is $125.
Why not make her pay that amount instead of a death sentence?
That's actually what their "death penalty" is trying to do. Apparently most of the money she stole is in overseas bank accounts and relies on her taking action to actually give it back. She has appeals and if she paid up the appeals will probably back down from the death penalty.
Well then. Murdering someone as ex-post "punishment" for past actions remains abhorrent, but holding a gun to her head until she gives the money back is cool and good.
There is a difference between threatening violence as a deterrent against currently engaged in harms a person has the ability to cease and claiming moral authority to end a person's life due to things they have no control over.
There's distinction between "Put down the box or we'll shoot you." and "Having touched the box in the past, you now need to die regardless."
Still don't fuck with "The death penalty" as a framework for the threat, however.
good intel, probably woulda been better included in the meme, though.
I'm guessing they take the money too
¿Porque no los dos?
She's had so much plastic surgery it looks like she's got Bell's palsy.
On one hand, you have to appreciate a little win here or there. Not often they see consequences.
In the other hand, you should probably have a beer or a nice, refreshing glass of fruit juice or something. Whatever you like, you know? Treat yourself, it's a special occasion!
I'm sure all those Vietnamese workers love walking past statues of Ho Chi Minh and liberationist/progressive/commie monuments on their way to work for multi-national companies or when speculating on the Ho Chi Minh stock exchange
It's just social democracy at this point tbh
Tho don't get me wrong, this one is not entirely on the CPV (even though the party bureaucracy plays a huge part in this), but simply losing virtually all networks of solidarity to other socialists contries (especially with China being on the capitalist road)
Says someone from a high horse in a wealthy neo-colonial Capitalists country that's allied with various genocidal regimes.
China 🤝 Vietnam
that's a weird way to spell "enabling them in the first place" 🤔
Criticising other countries for enabling billionaires is something I think only like Cuba can do.
Let's see:
Uh huh.
We've got a ways to go yet.
Yay for diversity?
i mean it's vietnam, i would expect non-white
Or just those that are not on "the line"? Like Russians falling out of windows. What is the actual truth behind this?
What do you mean by that? The articles about this have been all over on lemmy for the last few days. She got away with ~$9 billion in financial crimes for over a decade, with total damages estimated at $12.5 billion. Her husband was also caught for embezzlement of billions and is receiving a 9 year prison sentence.
Sounds like she must have gotten caught stealing from rich people for it to have been that much. You'll get in trouble for that anywhere. You may not get the death penalty but you may die in prison.
the actual truth appears to be that she committed an incredible amount of really basic, egregious fraud
The death penalty is always wrong.
Murder is not a punishment and once you've stripped her of her ill-got gains there is no longer any reason to kill her.
I hear you but if I’m honest, and tomorrow America announced it was going to execute every billionaire, I’m not going to put up too much of a protest.
Take the money, sure. Then they're no longer billionaires and there's no need to kill them.
The way these people affect so many lives negatively with their fraud is much worse than a person committing murder.
The literal misery they cause to so many people for their own benefit without a fucking iota of shame and their sociopathic behavior is enough to consider eliminating them from society.
Irrespective how is two bad things better than one bad thing? I would think fewer bad things would be net better.
You speak of "sociopathic behavior" while advocating state murder. 🤨
Up vote for use of iota correctly
I disagree. I don't subscribe to a world view where every life is sacred. Society has a right to protect itself from persons that will always endanger other people and that includes killing them. However, it has been quite clear that we cannot guarantee that no innocent people are killed. And that's why I'm OK with the death penalty only in principle, not in practice.
You cannot know that, and if you have the ability to strap someone down and end their life, you have no need to do so since you clearly have complete control over their person.
You shouldn't be. States qua arbiters of justice should not intentionally kill people under their control.
While I agree in principle I tend to think there are still unforgivable crimes and irredeemable people out there.
Then you don't agree.
I wasn't aware crime was about forgiveness.
I thought in-so-far as societies implemented systems of justice, their purpose was restitution and rehabilitiation.
No one gains anything from a person—irrespective their prior actions—being murdered and we all lose a bit of our soul each time a state execution is allowed to take place.
I really expected better from Vietnam, whose "quarantine at gunpoint" public health policies I heartily endorse.
the death penalty is always wrong, billionaires should die in unpredictable extrajudicial ways. like aneurisms, pianos, etc.
but its something.