Is SteamOS a future default for handhelds?
Given many new handhelds coming on the scene and general disinterest of Microsoft to support the market, do you think SteamOS will take place of default OS the same way Android did on phones some time ago?
Fuck I hope so
For the future of PC gaming I sure as hell hope so. People stick to and defend Windows as their go-to 'till the bitter end, likely not realizing Linux could be everything their Windows machine is and there is a real industry player with a lot of money making this reality right now. If we just let it.
If we would just give Linux the critical mass, we could free the last locked aspect of PC gaming, the OS itself. That way we would no longer be at the whims of Microsoft's decisions because let's face it, even Windows users hate the shit they do.
Linux, currently, cannot handle everything Windows can unfortunately. Windows also has a massive software support advantage. Valve are in the best place to try and give Linux to the masses, but that's a lot of work and it won't have much return for them. Windows getting worse is the way Linux will get more market share, but most people are not power users and will probably just use Windows anyway as it 'just works'.
Windows, currently, cannot handle everything Linux can. Linux also has a massive software support advantage, running on vastly more hardware and architectures than Windows does.
Linux has already been given to the masses. People use it every day in super user friendly ways; they just don't realize they're using Linux.
The only reason people use Windows is because they don't choose it. Imagine if every PC sold had a Linux option and a Windows option that cost an extra $100. What do you think people would buy?
The same hardware running Linux will easily outperform Windows (especially at the most common end user tasks like web browsing) by a long shot. In a few days NTFS turns 30 years old FFS (LOL).
Any given hardware accessory will "just work" when plugged in to a Linux PC but Windows will require a special driver that you have to go out and find on your own at the vendor's website that will be bloated AF. It'll also reinstall it if you change the USB port LOL.
I specifically phrased it "could be" as people tend to believe there are 3 preferences, Mac, Linux and Windows. Linux is not one user experience, it could work exactly like your favorite OS. In the face of SteamOS already being a viable option for the average gamer as Valve is basically strong arming it to be, on Steam Deck you're not exactly doing PC gaming any good deliberately installing Windows on it. SteamOS just works.
I also think you're very misguided in thinking it won't have any return to Valve. Microsoft has to be looking at Google Play Store and whatever the Apple Store is called with a lot of envy with how they've managed to lock the entire ecosystem under their stores. This is the end result for Windows as well and its likely anti-competetive clauses are a very bad sign for a company like Valve. Looking back I'm actually impressed just how far back Valve saw this happening. Decoupling PC gaming in its entirety from Microsoft's vendor lock-ins is in the best interest of all of the companies in the gaming industry, but it takes a rich private company like Valve to start doing the hard work for long term benefits instead of always chasing the short term profits.
Even if tomorrow Microsoft launched something that pulled ahead of SteamOS, it would still be in the gamers' best interest to stick with the open platform. With a consistent, large userbase on an open platform it will eventually eclipse anything Microsoft could ever muster.
Valve is doing this for strategic reasons and also because they wanted to start the handheld PC market (Steam Deck). Strategic reasons: Microsoft could at any point buy several important gaming studios or distributors, distribute a lot of games (maybe exclusively) via their own store (they even announced that several years ago, but they didn't do it in the end). MS could even implement small things which make Steam perform worse on Windows, as its 100% controlled by MS. If you compete directly with Microsoft on the Windows platform, you will eventually lose because MS can do some very tiny tweaks which happen to make your product be more annoying or slower to use than Microsoft's own. That way they'll still fly under the radar for anti-competitive behavior. So Valve has to ensure that their main business model (selling/distributing games on Steam) remains future-proof, and that means more independent from Microsoft's agenda. To do this, they need to push a fully neutral, but viable alternative to Windows for gaming. Which is Linux.
IMO Steam OS is the "Windows" for handhelds. Sure there will be lots of variants of Linux with custom skins (hell even Windows itself). However, I think Steam OS has already established itself as a comfortable default for most people due to how optimized the UI is for handhelds and the fact it works out of the box for most PC games without any tinkering 🙂
SteamOS's UI is incredible. It's not always easy for a UI to be feature rich while also being intuitive and easy to use, but Valve did a wonderful job. I love pulling up the Quick Menu to check the battery and time or tweak a setting without needing to pause the game or go back to the Home Menu.
SteamOS has been out on Steam Deck for 18 months, but still no general release in sight. I wouldn't hold my breath. I think we'll just have to continue to make do with the likes of ChimeraOS/Nobara.
Is there some specific feature that SteamOS brings to the table that people are looking for? So far as I know, a stripped down installation Debian or Ubuntu (Valve likes to base their packages off of Ubuntu) with an Xserver script that directly launches steam in big picture mode ought to create roundabout the same experience I would think.
SteamOS 2.x was based on debian, but that hasn't been updated in years. The Steam Deck launched with SteamOS 3, which is actually built on top of arch and is much more akin to Manjaro. As for your question, it's mostly the "game mode", which uses IIRC Wayland and wraps games inside gamescope which provides a bit more control in the form of controlling frame rate, resolution, etc externally, but regardless, that can and has been achieved in custom distros. I think the main appeal of SteamOS honestly is the package of an immutable OS optimized for running games on steam. It prevents non-linux users from breaking things and tries to make it feel more like a "console" with a "desktop mode" (KDE Plasma) and "app store" (ala flatpaks). I've toyed with the idea of running it or similar on my gaming PC but always run into the difficulty of Nvidia drivers on Linux.
True. There is an unofficial release - HoloIso - which uses Valves packages but is not quite complete. Also manufacturers may be able to get access as Valve previously has been keen on getting other manufacturers to buy into it's hardware attempts (e.g. Steam PCs previously, and VR now) but I'd expect the manufacturers to be making a big deal of it if they were launching a SteamOS handheld. It seems Valve want to keep exclusivity on Steam Deck for now (which makes some sense given how successful it's been)
I honestly think it's just because most people have nvidia and steam on linux and nvidia don't work well together and linux and nvidia and just nvidia in general. It works enough but is not a smooth experience. Maybe once the open source drivers are fleshed out more it'll be better
I'd love to see the return of Steam Machines. I loved the concept back in 2014 but Linux gaming absolutely wasn't ready back then. A first party Valve Steam Machine could be a great entry point for many potential new PC gamers.
I'd be curious what kind of APU they'd cook up for a Steam Machine because putting in a full GPU isnt economically viable right now.
I'd possibly argue a full GPU could be detrimental. Maybe best to aim for Steam Deck performance in a home console but with the potential for a GPU installation later on. Obviously being a home console would allow for a more power hungry but performamt APU. Maybe they could attain Series S performance whilst being a much more open platform.
It would be a good thing. Gaming on windows has been a shit experience since everything after windows 7. I don't want to have to manually(or scriptedly) remove candy crush installer icons among other bloat shit every time I install the os just for a basic clean experience that still spies in me.
Strong agree. Have you by chance checked out O&O Shut Up 10? I run it after every install and periodically to keep as much of the tracking disabled as I can. Highly recommended.
I used that 3 windows installations ago but switched to a PowerShell script that is backed up on my friends computer that I set up.
What are these many new handhelds you speak of
Ayaneo 2 is one apparently. ROG Ally is one. And there are at least 8 more: https://retrododo.com/best-handheld-gaming-pcs/
Steam OS is awesome. I consider myself a tech savvy person, yet I never felt the need to tinker with my Steam Deck to run retro games or emulate stuff since I have it (1+ year)
The library of games running natively or with minimal controller changes is so big I will probably not run out of games and Im playing more than ever.
Probably not while ARM handhelds are so popular. I think that it's a good choice for intel and AMD for now, though.
This is a weird comment to me, SteamOS could have an ARM build, Valve would just need to release a ARM build of their distro (and Steam for Linux).
There's definitely ARM for lots Linux software and distros, so assuming Valve hasn't done anything particularly weird, aside from the build infrastructure, that's probably not even that big of a job.
Lol there's a whole lot more to it then that. On top of needing to have proton/wine support ARM as well, which is super complex.
This would also open it up for running SteamOS VMs on Apple Silicon Macs. I was surprised how few distros actually supported arm I switched over and none of the gaming oriented ones I looked for had ARM support.
Why not for ARM handhelds? I don’t think there is anything that handles x86 on arm well outside of Apple. But there are some things on Linux that can do it.
I’ve not personally tried it though. Maybe I will today, I have a spare raspberry pi that’s not doing much.
I thought it would but it's been over a year and still no one is shipping with it.
Harsh take, these companies have very little in-house software talent and are too cheap to pay for it. That’s why they ship garbage Windows software instead.
Eventually SteamOS could work out of the box but currently requires some understanding.
What I mean is, I thought for sure Valve would make the OS available to third parties. Maybe even work with them to get it running properly on their hardware.
ETA Prime always referring to "Steam Deck OS" and claiming that's the name it's widely known by is so cringe.
I like it, if only because theres a lack of OS's that boot with controller support.
Only possible if all handheld machines have transparent hardware designs, i.e., all electronic components inside are known, have open source drivers and do not rely on third-party proprietary drivers or reverse engineering. This is due to Linux itself rely heavily on open source software and doesn't play well with proprietary parts (take Nvidia GPU for example, every person who has it in their Linux machine knows it causes headache once in a while). Unfortunately, so far only Valve's Steam Deck has a hardware specs that satisfy this requirement. The other ones more or less suffer from closed source components
Not really true. You don't necessarily need open source drivers for Linux to play well. There was actually a period where NVidia was the better option on Linux because their proprietary drivers were better than the alternatives. If the company cares to manage those drivers they will work well. That said, it looks like AMD has embraced FOSS and NVidia finally opened their other drivers, so things are looking up at least. Having binary blobs for certain shit is not ideal either, but I'll take it if it means more people will move to Linux and everything else will still be open.
I hope its form factor gets closer to the switch so its more mixed mode handheld/console.
Looking at how many celebrated ROG Ally shipping with windows I doubt it will catch on. Only possibility I see is if valve would do profit sharing with the handheld maker for purchases made in the steam store.
For a third party to ship with steam os now would essentially mean they are also supporting the largest player in the market with no gain for themselves.
I hope so, but only if the option to install other OS's remains an easy option. I love android but installing a different operating system on my phone is so much of a pain in the dick that it's not even worth it.
I feel like I'd probably avoid a handheld if the option to install windows wasn't there, even if I don't end up using it much.
If my choice was a default windows install with the option to install steamOS myself, or a default steamOS install with no other options, I'm choosing the windows install every time.
I do not get reference to smartphones. In US iOS is dominated system.
Like how Android OS is developed by Google but published for other phone manufacturers to use and build off of.
Ah! Got it. Like windows, Linux, etc…
No. Steamos is only really great on deck because of the whole making the hardware and software thing. If other people use it it loses that and you end up with a computer with a less compatible OS.
you know that manufacturer can hire staff to optimize steamOS for their hardware kinda like samsung did with android?
Sure. They could do that. That doesn't really address my point though. And it's really unlikely to happen on any meaningful scale, imo:
We already have some makers offering "steamos support" in the form of... basically a single steamos image they release once and don't steam to maintain? GPD's "GPD OS" from Dec 2022 and Anbernic's Win600 Steam OS image from Jan 2022.
And still the best way to run SteamOS on either of these devices is ChimeraOS.
The closest to what you're describing is AYANEO's ayaos. I don't know if it's a steamos fork or not, but it's their take on linux gaming OS. It's been in development for a while and we've got nothing but a few clips of it to view. And considering it mostly seems to replicate the Ayaspace windows app interface, I'm not sure it even offers any benefits over Windows+ayaspace.
No, Steam doesn't support arm. So my hacked Switch runs cobbled together emulationstation + xfce + antimicrox + onboard. I don't like Horizon OS and only SuperTuxKart works flawlessly on Android for me. In SuperTux, the sound desyncs from the game. Minetest doesn't support gamepads, and I couldn't find any Android alternative to AntiMircoX. I also just don't like how 99% of Android apps "need" Google Play Services.
Linux is what I need, but there isn't any decent interface that isn't SteamOS (x86 only) or RetroArch (everything must use libretro) or batocera.linux (their version of emulationstation completely shits itself when ran outside of batocera, and I really don't want to recompile batocera)
There are several x86/x86_64 on ARM emulators in development to solve this problem. The main two are box86 and FEX. Both are able to run Steam on ARM Linux already, with varying degrees of playability. There is also qemu which has been around for much longer, but qemu doesn't do much in the way of optimizing for speed while these newer emulators forward system and library calls on to native code where possible and use dynamic recompilation for speed.
I was able to play Half Life 2 from Steam on my PinePhone Pro when it first came out using box86. It was sort of playable.
I still prefer having a "native" system menu over one that's being emulated.
I'd be OK with that, it's been excellent so far!