My Father In Law’s Deathbed confession – what can I do to help?
My Father In Law’s Deathbed confession – what can I do to help?
TL;DR: My father in law (FIL) passed away recently. I visited him a few days before he died and he confessed to knowing where some bodies are buried and wanted me to help make it right.
Going back to the beginning: It was the mid 1970s and he was a young man struggling with work. He’d just trained as a digger/excavator operator and was trying to break into the construction industry but in the part of the country he lived in, it was more about who you knew rather than what you knew.
He’d applied to several different building firms for work but was getting nowhere, until one day, he received a phone call telling him to come to a construction site of a housing estate that was being built by a large British housing construction company. Relieved, he arrived early and was a very dedicated employee. For the next few months, he was praised and treated better than he’d ever been treated either at work or at home. The boss took him under his wing, taught him a lot about the trade and they developed a friendship.
One Saturday afternoon, his boss calls him. He tells him that he’s needed on site later that night and there were to be no questions asked. His boss also told him that after that night, he would invest in him and buy him a (used) digger so he could start his own company and rent himself and his digger to different building sites. This meant he could start his business, which is still ruining today and is now run by my brother-in-law.
He turned up to the site and was told to dig a trench of a specific size. When he had dug the trench, he waited for a short amount of time until people living on the completed part of the estate came out of a house across the road from this plot carrying black bags with something heavy in them. They were put in the trench and he was instructed to cover it back up again, which he did. FIL swears that they were dead bodies. Several of them.
When he tried to talk to his boss (who was also there), the boss reminded him of the no-questions and told him he would be getting his digger in a matter of days. He told him to never discuss this again and made some veiled threats. Within a short time he had his digger and built up his business over the years. He noted that that part of the housing estate was not being built on, but had tarmac laid on it. Eventually he moved to a different part of the country where there was more work, met my mother-in-law and moved on with his life and business.
He told me that the events of that night always played on his mind and was always at the back of his mind. He knew that he'd taken the digger as a hush payment and was afraid of his old boss.
Years later, shortly after I had married my wife, I showed him a new website: Google Street View. He was amazed by it. He told me that after I had left that day, he looked up that street on Google street view. The estate he had worked on was still standing. The plot he had dug a trench into had been left empty and still had tarmac laid on it. It wasn’t a park or a green-space, just a plot of tarmac. He told me the address and I was able to find it on Street View and the empty plot of tarmac is still there.
When I left, my mother-in-law (MIL) was at home, visiting my wife. She gave me a ring binder that FIL had kept. It was full of information about that estate, with land registry records, newspaper stories, housing sale information. There were also some missing persons stories from around the country from the same time, which were mainly kids. What was interesting were the numerous print-outs from local newspapers and from the planning department regarding that patch of land. The construction company that built that estate no longer existed and that plot of land had been purchased by a private developer. The developer had tried for years to build a house on that plot of land (as it was now a costly housing estate in a popular town). The developer had been stopped by the efforts of the people who lived directly opposite. I saw on the land registry that the house had stayed with the same owners since the mid 1970s and, as shown in local newspaper website printouts, they had called upon MPs, the planning department and even my FIL’s old boss (who became a local councillor). The last time there was an attempt to build on that land was 6 years ago. They had got it rejected on the grounds that it would destroy green-space, which was odd, because there was no green-space to be destroyed. It was just a patch of tarmac, now with some shoddy looking benches on it (to make it look more like a park, I suppose).
My FIL was convinced that they murdered several people, got away with it, and are still guarding the site where the bodies are buried. He tried to contact the police one one occasion, shortly after he was acquainted with street view. He left his phone number only to be called back by a councillor, who happened to be his old boss. This terrified my FIL. He believed his old boss was involved with organised crime and said that was part of the reason he moved to a different part of the country.
He asked me to help make it right. I’ve already tried calling the local police and was told in no uncertain terms to 'fuck off' and 'stop wasting police time'. I’m not sure what to do. I don’t want to endanger myself and my family but I want to help FIL with his last wish. He was absolutely convinced that there were bodies buried there and the evidence in the amount of effort gone into protecting that plot of land seems to suggest he might be on to something.
Any ideas?
Make the coordinates public and let curiosity run its course.
Since this is The Internet, I automatically assume that this story is made up until that happens. No disrespect to OP, I'm not saying that he is lying, but from my perspective it's all just text in a box on a website. If he is that concerned by it and the "authorities" are turning a blind eye, then he should make this public.
@OsakaWilson @Ace_of_spades I think this is probably the way to go. If you inquire directly, they can easily find out who is calling and what your relationship to that area is. If a bunch of random internet snoopers start raising red flags, there might not be a whole lot that they can do against general public inquiry. (They being the people who own the land, and the organized crime, including, it sounds like, the local police and politicians as well)
If you inquire directly, they can easily find out who is calling and what your relationship to that area is.
This already happened. They already know OP is interested because OP already inquired directly.
If the coordinates suddenly become public they’re going to know where that came from. And in case anyone is forgotten, this is an organization capable of producing multiple bodybags in a single go.
How likely are lemmy.world to give me up if the police asked? I'm concerned that whoever did this will be pissed off at me and my family.
Mate, good tip for internet use is knowing that law enforcement absolutely uses the same forums you do. There's always a chance none of them sees your post or if they did, they won't do anything, or if they do, their supervisors won't move on it... But as much as people like to paint LE as a block completely removed from society, they're really not. They routinely suck both at their jobs and as people, but that doesn't mean they're not still people with interests. And sites like Lemmy cater to pretty common interests, so naturally LE is going to be on them, especially the more tech inclined.
Anyway, if you've filed a report with the local PD there, it's possible to figure out this case and who you are for people with the right tools. Regarding your question in your post, if you think this case involves murders across state lines or where the locals clearly won't do anything, contact the state police and the FBI (or your country's equivalents, if they are safe authorities). Depending on the office, they can sometimes do a better job of keeping you anonymous, especially if you express that you're afraid for your life. If that hits a dead end, start contacting the press. Reporters love this sort of thing.
Frankly, I recommend pursuing this, but don't contact the locals again. Go to the feds or state. Assuming this is real and you're not just having fun with creative writing, it sounds like the community knows what's up but is being blocked by the local government. Since you're on the outside and essentially have a "deathbed confession," you're functionally a witness to what happened. I'm not strictly sure if you have an actual duty to report this, I don't know you, but seems like it would be nice if you did.
I'd say post it wayy in the future, at another platform, by a different, temp user over TOR. Just in case
The police are not going to ASK.
You already contacted the police about this. They are going to KNOW it was you.
Just stop, do nothing. Think of your family. Think about how nice it is to be alive. Think of all the things you could be doing other that going after literal skeletons from the past.
Oooh, I like this one. Post this story to 4chan with coords. Let the internet do it's thing.
Post it here and let's see if Lemmy is up for one of those moments of Reddit's golden past.
Honestly, just walk away.
If you really think this could endanger you and your family, just leave it alone. Your father-in-law's demons don't need to become yours. The knowledge of this weighed on him and scared him into inaction for decades, and now he's passing that burden on to you and your wife? It's kind of a dick move on his part to transfer that to his own daughter's family.
Sorry if that answer seems selfish or cowardly, but in case you get a bunch of responses urging you to play private investigator, I'd encourage a more reasonable approach. What matters more to you - the safety of you and your family, or alleviating the guilt of the already deceased?
Good luck to you either way.
This is a very pragmatic answer. Given how the police responded (and now they have my number) it seems the best course of action to take.
Yeah, you should’ve told the FIL on his deathbed to release the confession directly to the media and FBI, and refused to get involved for the safety of your family. The fact a local politician is implicated in organised crime would likely spur some traction.
Your second mistake was calling the local police from your own phone number instead of dropping an anonymous tip (ya dingus). Your 3rd mistake was posting a highly specific story on the internet that further implicates you directly as the source (triple dingus).
If I were you I might’ve salvaged my first mistake by anonymously tipping off the feds; perhaps posing as a serial killer or something, and confessing to hiding missing persons in that location. Something that would go over the heads of local police coverups without tying it back to me… Making this your children’s problem is a complete dick move, though. The asshole who prospered off a crime and did nothing about it for 50 years, continued being an asshole to the day he died and passed it onto his SIL… Doing anything with this information would be dangerous. All you should do now is pack it away, forget about it, and go on with your life.
You would have been much better off if you just leaked the information on 4chan through tor, and never posted anything anywhere that could have been linked back to you.
Either just stay quiet or give the motherfucker the book and ask nothing from him. The cops having your number plus this post is a bad mix.
How many other families may be endangered? Sorry this is very sorry sighted.
It is easy to say when it is not you. Unless you are in that exact situation their complexities mean that you really shouldn't judge others for the approaches they take. Even if you would take the risk, judging others when they wouldn't is not really a good policy.
💀
There is now!!
Just post all this and the coordinates anonymously to some True Crime forums and let the obsessed people hound it.
Calling the local PD was a laughably bad idea. But unfortunately that train has sailed.
Not sure what country you're in, but at least in the US there is some precedent for a dying declaration being used to secure a warrant for search.
Considering how long ago this was and the fact that there is zero actual evidence I think you face a pretty extreme uphill battle in anything being done about this. It also sounds like, given your story, local authorities could be in on it. Makes it even harder.
Without directly pursuing this yourself using your own resources, potentially legally grey area tactics, and likely endangering yourself I have a hard time believing much can or will be done about this. But it's definitely a compelling story and I agree with the other poster that publicizing it may be your best bet.
MP (member of Parliament) suggests UK, Canada, Australia, etc. Digger suggest UK afaik.
That and the part where it says it's in the UK.
Whether true or not, I enjoyed reading the story, so, thanks for posting
I’ve already tried calling the local police and was told in no uncertain terms to ‘fuck off’ and ‘stop wasting police time’
This doesn't sound right. Maybe there's a way to raise this with higher level of the police system? It's also possible that the police is having an investigation already.
But if there is an investigation ongoing don't they have to say so? I mean I know they shouldn't disclose contents of it, but I suppose that's something I'd assume to hear then.
"stop wasting police" sounds remarkable recognisent of some different police corruption stories.
I do think the only way you can be sure this is made right is to publish and let ppl dig into it. First metaphorically and then literally as well of course.
No, sometimes disclosing the fact of an investigation can compromise it. They often won't say one way or the other.
Yes. Even the police chief has a boss. Typically that's the mayor, county executive, or even governor.
Assuming this is real, avoid the local pd. Contact your country's version of the FBI. Tell them you fear for your family's safety, there have been threats, and that organized crime might be involved. They can use ground penetrating radar to see if there's potentially any bodies under there before they even dig.
Okay, there's a lot that's been said here, some ideas I liked, some were not great.
If you decide on action, do it later, when the internet isn't actively discussing it on a public forum. Consider deleting your account. You can make a new one under a new name, no problem.
If you decide to let your FIL's guilt remain as his guilt, instead of taking this on yourself, then that's the end of it. A story told on the internet with no proof that any of it is true. You'll be safe, your family will be safe, and you will hopefully live to a ripe old age.
If you instead, want to take action, after this account has been scrubbed, and enough time has passed, the way I see it, you have a few options... You can try to run this up the law enforcement food chain, but that's a very direct approach, and the safety of you, your family and your friends, may be at risk. If that is too much risk for you, and I wouldn't blame you if it was, you could investigate personally, maybe finding a way to procure a ground penetrating radar.... Naturally, at least on the surface of the purchase, you'd be buying it for the construction company to make sure there's nothing important like water lines or electricity under the surface of the ground before digging, but maybe you need to borrow it for a night and drive out to a remote patch of tarmac and see for yourself if there's anything hiding down there.... If there is, make a choice on what to do next.
Alternatively, you could try to go public, and get the information to the press anonymously, and see if that goes anywhere. It might, you never know.
My favorite option is to simply rewrite this story, as a less personal one, tersely, and post it on 4chan's /b/ with the GPS coordinates of the site and maybe a street view picture. Of the location.... And see what the Anon's think of it. They may run with it and do all the work for you, or it might die in the firey pit that is 4chan. This is by far the most anonymous, especially if you don't include that you knew the digger, or that he had any relation to you, just a telling that this happened, with enough to pique the curiosity of the people there...
These are simply options. I can't, and won't make your choice for you. I don't have to live with the outcome, I'm just a stranger on the internet, likely hundreds, if not thousands of miles away, and I won't suffer any consequences for what you choose.
I will say that I wouldn't be able to rest, knowing this. I would be compelled to take some kind of action, regardless of what may happen to me. The worst-case scenario my brain can come up with is that the family across the street, either is, or previously was, diddling kids, and when those kids got too old, they disposed of the evidence, witnesses and victims, all in one act. If they are willing to do that in ~1970, to cover it up, then I can only imagine that if they're still at it, they've gotten very good at hiding the bodies. The potential for future victims and the drive I have to make this planet and the people who live here, something I can be proud to be a part of, would push me into doing something about it, at the very least to determine if the story has any merit at all, and if it does, to ensure that anyone who may have been a participant in what happened to those kids, the ones I envision in my mind as laying in that grave, don't end up with their friends and peers down there with them. If there's even the slightest chance it's still happening, and I can do something about it, I'm going to.
That's me though. I'm not you, I can't take that risk, or relieve you from the consequences of it.
No matter what you decide OP, think about it, for a good, long while. I assume you've shared this with your wife, and if so, have a frank discussion with her about what to do. If not, I would try to leave her out of it. No need to burden her with the literal skeletons in her dad's figurative closet. If you're going to keep this a secret, make it one that you take to your grave. Don't burden your FIL's grandchildren, or anyone else with it. Forget you ever heard this story. Don't write it down, don't tell it to anyone. Just forget it and move on with your life. It was a dick thing to do for your FIL to put this on you; so don't feel guilty about it. It's his guilt, not yours.
Maybe approach a news outlet?
This is a great idea. If they get a hunch that this is true (maybe approach with evidence?) they have a bunch of different tools and they can pressure ppl to look into this.
Maybe approach a wall outlet … with a fork.
Why is nobody considering the possibility that the mafia will retaliate against the known collaborators if this comes to light?
Because people both under and overestimate organized crime. It is a weird beast. The majority of people don't run into them in a way they know it. And when you for some reason do, you learn to shut your mouth entirely or apart from the need-to-know basis depending on your cause to have run-ins with them. Not always because you think they are going to retaliate but from pretty complex reasons.
According to your tale, this old boss has some serious connections if inquiries 50 years later are still being directed to him and he called your dad back instead of a law enforcement official that should have been the one returning the call. 50 years later, they can still squash any attempts to turn up the soil.
I know what I'd do, anonymously send a package to the law enforcement agency and then nothing more. There's absolutely no way I'd risk the safety of my family for a man that knew he was burying bodies and took compensation for it. It was his burden to make it right and it's another indecent thing he's doing to place this burden on you for what I am guessing he thinks is for the benefit of his mortal soul. He apparently doesn't want to risk his son's life with this task so he's reaching out to you, someone that's a bit more disposable.
You didn't kill anyone and you didn't help hide the bodies. Don't be the single person in this whole fucked up thing to get punished for it.
He tried to contact the police around 2008/9. The old boss has since died (obituary was in his notes).
FIL thought that his old boss was involved organised crime, so I agree with you on not risking my family's safety to alleviate my dead FIL's guilt.
Good point, he's pretty much the asshole here
Agreed, HTA
You are going to have to decide how much risk to yourself and your family you are willing to accept. If you really want to do this then stop contacting the local authorities and go up the chain. In the United States I'd walk into an FBI office with a full copy, not the originals, of your files along with a typed up description of every detail including what happened when your FiL and yourself tried calling it in to the local authorities.
In the UK it would seem to be the National Crime Agency as they are the ones that handle Organized Crime however they say that they don't take reports from members of the Public. They want people like you to give your information to https://crimestoppers-uk.org/give-information/forms/give-information-anonymously and then let it percolate through the system.
If you don't want to do that or nothing happens when you do then I'd suggest going to a Solictor and discussing the matter with them.
Edit: It's very strange that the UK's national law enforcement doesn't have an official Government engagement point with the public. In the US you can directly contact nearly all of the Federal Law Enforcement agencies including the FBI, Secret Service, US Marshalls, DEA, BATFE, ICE and many more. Hell even the CIA will take phone calls from the regular public!
Perhaps an anonymous tip saying there’s approx 1 tonne of cocaine buried under the patch which is routinely removed and replaced.
Send to local papers too.
Anything to get someone out there with a shovel.
It's tarmac, though. Can't exactly rip up and replace tarmac every time there's a cocaine sale. Better to do as you suggest with the real story, and tell newspapers as much as possible. Hell, tell some true crime communities, they'll make such a ruckus that the police can't keep sweeping it under the rug
This all sounds a little farfetched, but if this isn't all hot air then it sounds like Mr. Mafia has the local PD in his pockets somehow. If you want the site investigated then you're either going to have to contact a higher power or the local news station.
Idk how it works where you are, but here 3+ bodies makes it a serial killer which means that the feds can get involved, but you pretty much just hand it off and hope for the best.
If you want to pursue it more personally, then get in touch with a local news station or an investigative journalist. If it's a slow news day they may take the time to look into it, but they may ask you for an interview which could open you and your family up to retaliation.
If your FIL had written and signed a confession you may have more to work with because as it stands you have to hope that a valuable plot of land going unexploited is curious enough to warrant a second look. You should also be aware that if Mr. Mafia knows that it could become an issue, he may just move the bodies and then you really are just wasting everyone's time.
I would share that with the FBI.
This is a job for BURT MACKLIN
You can try telling the CIA and/or Interpol. Locally, you can try the National Crime Agency, Scotland Yard's Counter Terrorism Command, and Scotland Yard's Specialist Crime Directorate.
https://www.cia.gov/report-information/
https://nationalcrimeagency.gov.uk/contact-us
You can also try reporting to CrimeStoppers:
I strongly encourage you to use as many anonymizing methods as possible if you truly believe your safety to be in jeopardy should you be discovered.
**Edit since you probably need witness protection now:
Try asking the NCA about becoming a Protected Person if you contact them. https://nationalcrimeagency.gov.uk/what-we-do/how-we-work/providing-specialist-capabilities-for-law-enforcement/protected-persons
Anonymous methods aren't safe anymore. OP father already revealed to the old boss that he tried to contact police. If anything happens now, it all points to them. They need witness protection program if they want to be safe
Bring in an independent contractor w/ ground penetrating radar to corroborate the story. They can see thru asphalt and tell if the ground has been disturbed deep. Also look to see if their is an area of subsidence in the asphalt. Another sign of digging deep and not repacking proper and something decomposing and leaving a void..
Also the people that want to develop the land might want in as they are paying taxes on a useless plot. Also local media, true crime bloggers/youtubers, etc. The more light you shine the less likely they can go after you.
You mentioned the missing persons reports being mainly children... maybe you'd get more traction from Operation Hydrant, which took over the Yewtree investigations.
Or maybe cook up a story about some old king being buried there.
He had missing children's reports and clippings in his notes from around that time, but I didn't know if or why he thought they were the ones buried there.
If you see a news article about a nutter trying to dig up the final resting place of King Arthur over the next year, you'll know your plan worked!
This is incredibly descriptive for a story told to you as a deathbed confession.
This is the shortened version! He died a few days after this, so its not like he's was doing a death rattle when he told me this. Plus I have his big binder to go off too. He kept a lot of notes.
That happened 🙄
I have a totally wild idea for you since it sounds like you are in the UK:
Get a local archaeology group interested.
But, they only have 3 days to find out.
Toh-nee, we got a lovely bit o' pot down 'ere!
Damn OP. Real or not, I miss this kind of content which until now I haven’t seen in lemmy apart from the legendary poop and bean post, but is plenty on the other site.
You made my day OP. I wish a lot more people post with this level of quality.
I hope you get the right advice and do the right thing. Take care always.
In the interest of your safety (and that of your fam), I'd seriously consider backing off for now until you're sure the next move you make is a safe one. The police notified your FIL's old boss that he tipped them off, and even though you're in a different part of the country (by the sound of it), it's possible the old boss might learn you also called about the property. And if you and your FIL were the only ones to ever ask questions about the property, you're potentially drawing attention to yourself if you make the info public, even if it's done anonymously. I mean, who else would they suspect?
I'm not saying to do nothing; I have no suggestions on what you can actually do. But your FIL is dead (I am sorry for your loss), so no one's going to be disappointed if you call a time out and take time to think things through. Because if your suspicions are true, these are dangerous people you're dealing with here. Be careful, OP.
Good advice. Thanks.
County Non-Emergency Line - I need to file a report regarding my deceased father. I'd like an officer to meet me at my house.
Local News Email - My dad buried bodies yo.
It was in the UK
Honestly the only surefire answer is to lie and forge some paperwork, hire a contractor to rent a backhoe and ruin the asphalt, and then when the city stops you notify them of a sinkhole beneath.
They'll dig and find whatever is there to find.
Yse as many cutouts as you can, but you're already fairly exposed if this is true by your FIL's actions. So have an alibi while all this is happening.
I find it really really hard to believe that the police were not interested.
Just paint ‘no dead bodies under here’ on the tarmac
In the UK you put "Fred West woz ere" and wait
Contact the coroner or the medical examiner's office. Could also try local police, state police, or federal police.
I'm in Canada where hundreds of bodies of native children were discovered. Nothing changed except people are now more upset. I'm guessing even if there are bodies buried there nothing is going to happen with them, which is probably why police don't care.
This is interesting. I just read about the residential schools in Canada off the back of your comment. Nuts. Interestingly, in FIL's notes he suggests a few times that the bodies belonged to people from an often maligned and persecuted ethic group in the UK. He doesn't say why he thinks they were members of that group but mentions it a few times in his notes.
I guess we know what happened to Jimmy Hoffa now.
it wouldn't be uncommon for the family of the missing people to have hired a private investigator. you may be able to follow up if they are their company are still in business. The state police or FBI could be called in hopes they would not be as dismissive as the local cops.
Your father in law is dead. You and your family are alive. You should not endanger your family to assuage a dead man’s conscience.
Thanks. I'm coming around to this way of thinking.
Here’s a little exercise. Pick up a hammer. Now tap yourself, as lightly as you possibly can, in the head with that hammer.
Just to give your skull the sensation of encountering that steel. Just the slightest of taps.
Don’t imagine it. Do it. If you don’t have a hammer, use a rock. Just the lightest of taps.
Then, only after you have done that little tap, extrapolate that to what a dedicated person swinging that hammer at full speed could do to you.
Mortality is real. Your body is frail and temporary. The comfort and safety of our civilization are an illusion, and you can be hurt horribly.
We are in a boat in a river full of thrashing piranhas. Here in the boat the piranhas are neat. But climbing out of the boat changes the entire equation.
How many other families are endangered because of ongoing issues?
If the local police won't do anything, reach out to the next level. I think most countries have multiple levels. Let them take it.
Bring a shovel and flashlight, we going to dig up a parking lot.