Reminder

Saw him play recently in Alabama. They were selling this phrase on a shirt. Much to my surprise, that shirt was sold out by the time I went to pick it up. I was pleasantly shocked.
- Saw someone wearing that shirt in a shopping mall in the UK!
- $50 each no doubt
  
  That's how bands make most of their money in the streaming era and with ticketmaster raking in a big chunk of the ticket sales despite not providing much.
- Reading that makes me very happy! I try tell people this whenever I can: there's hope everywhere in America, no matter how red a state is now it can become blue one day. I was a Trump supporter myself and changed, other people can too! Think about all the people in Alabama who bought that shirt. If they banded together they could change Alabama for the better. Things won't be instant but perhaps they get a better mayor elected, then a better state representative then send someone better to the House, then one day a better Senator. If we try and work together it can happen!
- Just checked their online merch page and the shirt isn't there. But third-party shirt printers are easy to find and cost not much. Everyone who can should buy one and wear it proudly.

The only viable solution when Nazis take control of government is violence. There is no reasoning with them, they are not logical.
- This is correct, and also, Nazis don't care about good faith argumentation. They're explicitly anti-liberal (as in, liberty, freedom) and will only pretend to have these values to try and point out an apparent contradiction ("You believe in rights to speech and democracy, so why are you censoring us?")
  In this video of former white supremacists talking about how they left the ideology, one brings up that on their Nazi website, it was normal and common to argue for points they knew were garbage, like the Great Replacement theory. It's about power and results, not liberalist idealism.
  Violent methods usually aren't the preferred way of dealing with Nazis (because it's harder to get a mass movement to join in and support it, and because it's riskier, legally, which makes it harder to sustain), but it works. It broke up the BUF in Britain, it's kept the local turds scared to show their faces or reveal their true thoughts (don't worry, they still usually get revealed by researchers anyway). Violence works. They know it and we know it. But when they're the government, their violence is now legal.
  
  these values to try and point out an apparent contradiction ("You believe in rights to speech and democracy, so why are you censoring us?")
  Nazis want to take that freedom
- History has proven this.
- The violence came from outside the country last time. That's not happening this time.
  
  Except maybe the troll you are replying to wants violence. 🤷
- Yeah? You and what army? Seriously tho I'm looking to join.
  
  I am exercising my 2nd amendment rights, purchasing multiple firearms for multiple purposes and have signed up for classes at a local range. I'm with you, but acknowledge that this part of it feels like a lonely endeavor.

Nazis deserve exactly as much mercy and tolerance as they give to others.
- There, the solution!
  Repay everyone exactly as much tolerance as they give to you
  
  No, this wording is bad.
  I get a lot of tolerance from Nazis, because I'm a big, white, blue eyed, german dude. And I do not intend to give that back, I'll give them exactly as much tolerance as they give to my ethnic or sexual minority brothers and sisters.

Violence against Nazis isnt the answer, its a question and the answer is always yes.

Paradox of tolerance.
The paradox of tolerance is a philosophical concept suggesting that if a society extends tolerance to those who are intolerant, it risks enabling the eventual dominance of intolerance, thereby undermining the very principle of tolerance.
In a tolerant society we must be intolerant of intolerance.
- Edit - My mistake, I somehow was blind to the first in-.
   
  In a tolerant society we must be intolerant of intolerance.
  No we musn't. The intolerant have broken the social contract and are no longer extended that latitude.
  
  Screw the paradox. Tolerance is a social contract. Intolerant people aren't covered by the contract, therefore intolerance of intolerance isn't hypocritical or paradoxical.
  
  You are agreeing. They said we must be INtolerant of intolerance.
- My only disagreement with Popper is hes too lenient in what counts as intolerant

I'll upvote Tom Morello anytime
- Upvote ticketmaster
  
  When I was a Republican I saw this talking point come up a lot and sadly I used to buy into it. Basically GOPers attack RATM by claiming they are actually part of the machine and justify their argument by saying other people such as outspoken actors in Hollywood have the same politics and that they charge high ticket prices and use services such as Ticketmaster, perform at large venues and associated with Sony Music (through Epic Records).
  Reflecting on this it's not a good argument. In life things are not perfect so while they may be doing things like using Ticketmaster they are still doing a lot of good things and working towards a more fair and equitable society, perhaps one day in part due to their music motivating and encouraging people to elect more progressive people Ticketmaster will be regulated or broken up.
  It's surprising to me to see the same talking points I'm familiar with come not from the right but come from the left because you and RATM likely have a lot in common when it comes to political stances. For example I'm sure you and RATM are both against police brutality. Even if Sony manufactures RATM's CDs isn't it a lot better that someone has RATM playing in their car instead of whatever right wing talk show trash is playing on Clear Channel-owned stations (now called iheartmedia)?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tom_Morello#Politics
- This guy is based af

Sigh... I miss the days when Rage Against The Machine focused on music and wasn't political.
- I know right! The band didn't start getting political until 1991.
  
  Now that I think of it the whole 90s didn't start getting political until around 1991.
- Stupid conservatives think, "fuck you, I won't do what you tell me," is speaking to them. Your spoiler / deflection is absolutely necessary. There are a lot of people who don't understand what they take in.
  
  There are a lot of people who don’t understand what they take in.
  Sorry, that went way over my head. /s
- What machine do these people think they are raging against? A dishwasher?
  
  Hp printer
- Right wing guy in my discord said it was one of his 1st concerts. Like dude, are u deaf?

Organize and protect yourselves and those you care about, Nazis won't care.
- Arm yourselves.
  The Nazis are already armed.
  
  Yep, becoming familiar with firearms is something I wish was unnecessary, but until the working class is liberated it's necessary. I dream of a future where the working class has won triumphantly, worldwide, and that violence fades into urban legend outside of somber historical remembrance.
  
  Diesel, bear spray, propane, and gasoline don't care if you're wearing a bulletproof vest.
  Just pointing that out in case it becomes relevant.

Nazis deserve to be shot and killed
- Nazi is a mental illness, sequester them and heal, or keep boxed forever incommunicado to prevent spread of the disease.

the goat

I wanna hear everyone's fight music! I've been leaning on RTJ the last few days.
- Probably a lot of obvious choices on here, but I like to think of it as honoring the classics of the genre, and hopefully there are a few entries which are new to folks.
  Crime Mob - Knuck if You Buck (this goes at the start of the playlist, because, in my experience, playing this to a crowd of significant size will result in hands being thrown somewhere, it is a statistical inevitability)
  Godsmack - I Stand Alone
  ~~Pantera - Walk~~ Phil Anselmo is a Nazi shit weasel and I was unaware.
  Limp Bizkit - Rollin
  Rage Against the Machine - Fistful of Steel
  Lil Wayne ft Eminem- Drop the World
  CKY - 96 Quite Bitter Beings
  DMX - X Gon Give It To Ya
  Ludacris - Get Back
  KMFDM - Free Your Hate
  Aesop Rock - None Shall Pass
  Powerman 5000 - When Worlds Collide
  Static-X - Push It
  DJ Shadow ft Run the Jewels - Nobody Speak
  Nick Cave and the Bad Seeds - Red Right Hand
  Slipknot - People=Shit
  Slayer - Raining Blood
  Holy Fuck - Tom Tom
  Danzig - Mother
  Queens of the Stone Age - You Think I Ain't Worth a Dollar, But I Feel Like A Millionaire (gotta find an edit without the intro tho)
  Mastodon - Blood and Thunder
  Mïngle Härder (formerly Möngöl Hörde) - Blistering Blue Barnacles
  Two nautical themed metal/hardcore songs which get me ready to tussle isn't a lot, but it is weird that it happened twice.
  Rise Against - State of the Union
  Coheed and Cambria - Key Entity Extraction V: Sentry the Defiant (with honorable mention to In Keeping Secrets of Silent Earth:3 and Welcome Home)
  Chevelle - The Red
  Bullet For My Valentine - Waking the Demon
  Eve 6 - Think Twice
  Hole - Violet
  Dead Kennedys - Nazi Punks Fuck Off
  Smashing Pumpkins - Bullet With Butterfly Winds
  That seems like enough brainstorming for now. Hope someone finds something they vibe with.
  
  Definitely need to take Pantera off your Nazi fighting list.
  https://www.theguardian.com/music/2023/jan/26/pantera-shows-cancelled-after-frontmans-nazi-salute-prompts-fan-backlash
  
  +1 for State of the Union and Sentry the Defiant. I also see your Waking the Demon and raise you one You want a Battle? (Here's a War). I don't know if we're all against Anti-flag with Justin Sane being a trash human, but their catalogue is still good for this situation.
  
  I've known about KMFDM for a long time but discovered Free Your Hate about this time in 2017, it's too bad it's that relevant again but at least we've got some good Nazi-punching music.
- Propaghandi is a big one for me since they're from my city, but also Dead Kennedys, NoFX, Stray From the Path, Jeff Rosenstock
  Edit:
  I have more 😈:
  John K. Samson/The Weakerthans
  Nick Shoulders
  Jesse Welles
  The Narcissist Cookbook
  Jason Isbell
  John Prine
  Woody Guthrie
  The Coup
  Larry and his Flask
  Jordan Smart
  Phil Ochs
  Watchhouse
  Warren Zevon
  Elvis Costello
  The Orphans
  Mischief Brew
  The Tillers
  Country Joe McDonald
  Barbara Dane
  They Might be Giants
  David Rovics
  Sorry, music and finding it is a special interest.
  
  Don't be sorry ✊
  
  Of that list, I know TMBG. Always a fav of mine, and I appreciate their attempts to educate and promote science. The sun is a miasma of incandescent plasma!
  
  Add Leslie Fish to the list!
  
  That whole proapgandhi thing about then regretting the lyrics to Halle salasse up you ass for talking shit about Rastafari was dumb. That religion is nuts.
- Yess, I've been trying to explore punk. Give me punk bands with lyrics I can understand, and who are vocally critical of conservatism and fascism please.
  For myself -
  A lot of RATM has floated to the top for me in the past few years. They are in heavy rotation now, and weren't really for about fifteen years prior to that. The songs you don't immediately think of when I say RATM have lyrics that are just as true and just as biting. If you like their sound but aren't familiar with most of their work, this is a good time.
  Brother Ali - particularly songs like Uncle Sam Goddamn
  Dropkick Murphys, particularly most of the Album "This Machine Still Kills Fascists"
  Anti-Flag. I know they have proven to have done some shady things with regard to harassing some women at their shows, but I only just discovered them recently (and learned this about them afterwards.) Unfortunately I like their songs and lyrics. "Victory or Death" comes to mind immediately.
  Public Enemy - By the time I get to arizona, Black steel in the hour of chaos, fight the power (obv), fight the power 2020, really I don't think they do a song that's not good for the current state of affairs. Over and over in recent years I have concluded that the hip hop community saw what was and what was coming long before (decades before) the rest of us. I wonder why. 🤔
  Last couple Arrested Development albums. Good tracks off the top of my head "And This I know" "The Meek" "Amazing" "Fire" "Moses" Gotta listen to these, most aren't going to leap out with the expected energy if you don't pay attention to the lyrics all the way through. There are others. Their last three albums have a high percentage of gems IMO.
  Really old one by B. Dolan called "Which side are you on?" (loosely based aoround Guthrie song) which is congruent with a lot of today's issues, though I think it was written primarily in support of this woman. Gonna link it here because I just listened to it again and damn does it slap.
  A lot of what I listed above is unsurprisingly posted by me or others in !music@lemmy.world
  
  All of these groups rule. Good taste in music
  
  UK Subs - Riot, Social Distortion - Don't Drag Me Down, Restraining Order - Fight Back, The Casualties - 1312, Pennywise - Fuck Authority, Against All Authority - We Won't Submit, Descendants - 'Merican (ugh, the formatting on mobile isn't wonderful)
  
  Further recommendations for your exploration: any band Ian MacKaye has played in. Even if you don't care for his work, he has had an outsized impact on the development of American punk / hardcore (even if he's resisted that attribution). Specific recommendations include:
  Minor Threat - self titled (straight up hc punk)
  Embrace - Building (early emo, when that just meant it was a hardcore song that touched on emotions other than anger)
  Fugazi - Waiting Room, or the 13 Songs album as a whole (post-hardcore, or "hardcore, but we're not afraid to show off that we've learned some music theory")
  Okay, with MacKaye given his due, other "classic punk" recommendations include:
  Agent Orange - Bloodstains
  Bad Brains - I Against I
  Black Flag - Fix Me, TV Party, My War
  Circle Jerks - Wild in the Streets, Live Fast Die Young, World up My Ass
  Dead Kennedys - Nazi Punks Fuck Off, California Über Alles, Holiday in Cambodia
  Germs - Lexicon Devil
  The Clash - Straight to Hell, White Riot, Lost in the Supermarket, and many more.
  Operation Ivy - Sound System
  The Descendents - Suburban Home
  Social Distortion - Story of My Life, Mommy's Little Monster
  Buzzcocks - Ever Fallen in Love (With Someone You Shouldn't've)?
  Hüsker Dü - Don't Wanna Know If You Are Lonely, Pink Turns to Blue
  The Replacements - Androgynous, Bastards of Young, Here Comes a Regular, Can't Hardly Wait, Answering Machine, Alex Chilton
  Minutemen - History Lesson Part 2, Corona
  Some slightly deeper cuts, more in the proto-emo space than political punk, but they share a lot of musical DNA and I think some of these tracks are underrated.
  Rites of Spring - For Want Of
  The Hated - Words Come Back
  Dag Nasty - Circles
  Gray Matter - Burn No Bridges
  Soulside - Pearl to Stone
  IGNITION - Previous
  Fire Party - Cake
  Samiam - Tired of Waiting
  Fuel - Cue to You
  Drive Like Jehu - Here Come the Rome Plows
  That's probably enough for now. I hope you find some stuff you like here.
- Maybe Im basic but Rise Against still hits. Sudden Urge goes hard. Also turns out they just released a new song within the last 24h that I need to listen to
  
  I need to poke at their newer stuff. I kinda stopped paying attention to their new releases after Black Market and the one single they released a couple years after that, but there's a few songs that hit that older style like The Eco Terrorist in Me that still go hard. I do respect that even as the sound left my general preferred punk sound, their lyrics remained as complex and literary as always (seriously how often are you looking up words from song lyrics in a dictionary?)
  
  +1 Sudden Urge!
  I slept on most of the post-Endgame catalogue except for maybe 5 songs, and this was not one of them. I eased up on the skip button one day in the car recently and got to hear it again, for what felt like the first time. It gave me chills.
- From old timey union fight songs (ex Workers of the world, Awaken) to protest rock. The Swedish band Nationalteatern have a great banger "Staten och Kapitalet" about that the state and the capital sit in the same boat, but it is not those who row and the whip does not lick their fat necks.
  
  I've been loving the old Pete Seeger, Woody Guthrie, Phil Ochs, Billy Bragg, and Barbara Dane
  This music just hits so hard
- Dead Prez been radical and vocal about social and political issues since long before everyone else got there. Music is probably dated by now but their messages have always been consistent and they are very applicable today.
- Basically anything off of Idles' 2020 masterpiece, Ultra Mono. Grounds is probably the most direct fight song. My other favorites are War, Mr. Motivator, and Carcinogenic.
- Show Me the Body is great.

hE sHoULd sTAy oUt oF puHLityiCks

100% agreement here.

Guys he's just a Nationalsozialistische
He's supporting ya'll americans Führer

Tom Morello isn’t qualified to speak about politics.
- Are you sure? https://web.archive.org/web/20220216105516/https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EZ202WNUwAAR7YS.jpg
  
  It’s not like he graduated from Harvard University with honours as a Political Science major.
  He’s just some pop artist who Paul Ryan loves.
  
  Honors grad means you didn't do any of the work to get it

If only his solo music was as good as his politics. The difference in quality between his work with RATM and his solo output is mind boggling.
- That feels unnecessarily harsh. Especially since music is subjective and he's purposefully not using his greatest skill, the electric guitar... and while I'm not a fan of the nightwatchman stuff, the music itself isn't bad, just not my cup of tea. Also, the Audioslave stuff is great too, not just RATM. That's already two hugely successful bands, which is 2 more than most artists.
  
  Audioslave was pretty good too and I also like some nightwatchman stuff, but the three albums he put out as "Tom Morello" (The Atlas Underground Series) are just something else. They basically sound like a compilation of his favorite artists in a 1000 different genres and he overdubbed the whole thing with some guitar riffs.
  Sure there might be a decent track here or there (but mostly because of strong guest performances), but other than that the albums are an unfocussed mess. IMO.