I've noticed that lemmy as a whole is much more leftist than reddit (outside of political servers of course)
I've noticed that lemmy as a whole is much more leftist than reddit (outside of political servers of course)
I can't really think of a reason for that as Reddit is hated somewhat equally by "both" sides of the spectrum. It's just something I find interesting.
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Not really meaning for this to sound as arrogant as it's going to, but... Lemmy is almost entirely populated by nerds so far.
Nerds tend to be open to tech, maybe a little smarter overall. You know? You can tell by the grammar, the spelling. It's a different group here.
Reality is left leaning, and the stupider someone is, in general, the more likely they are to lean right politically. The rest of the right are the really rich, who tend to be up the psychological spectrum toward sociopathic, so of course they would have no time for caring for others' needs.
Reality is left leaning…
It really is. So much of conservatism involves pissing into the wind, and trying to argue against objective truth.
Reality is left leaning
I know this was a joke Colbert made, but the truth is the reverse: the left is reality-leaning. It's truly terrifying to see how divorced from reality the right-wing is, and how gleefully they just keep storming in that direction.
To an extent. But whenever there is a political discussion on Hacker News, the lib right response is very, very loud, and I try to remind myself I appreciate Hacker News for its tech news.
I think the culture is just different. Lemmy was started and run by Tankies. Hacker News was started by Y Combinator, which incubates silicon valley startups. They're going to attract different audiences, or at least different groups of people who will put up with different politics. I can't claim to be particularly upset about the .ml domains being pulled and the center mass of Lemmy moving away from those instances.
What's a tankie? I keep seeing it.
I had to look it up too. Apparently it's an authoritarian leftist. Thinks state-socialism was a good thing. As while most leftists are more of the democratic, market, and anarchist varieties.
State socialism is a good thing, what tankies promote is something else, they're fascist that can't accept that fact because it would mean having something in common with the fascists in the USA, a country that they hate so much that they're ready to deny reality to have an anti USA opinion.
I'm confused, and you seem to be a lot more familiar with the term. I read the wiki link that explains tankies. I don't personally know any left leaning people who support Russia/Stalin/China regimes. Maybe because of my America-centric viewpoint and where things are today, but typically people who are economically left are also socially and politically left (equal opportunity is more important than individual freedoms), which is very anti-fascist. I've heard people say how great a true communism could be if it were possible, but no one's ever made it past a dictatorship to get there.
Are tankies people who are economically left but socially and politically right, and think someone has achieved a communist utopia without knowing anything about the corrupt oligarchies in Russia or CCP China?
The problem is not state socialism, it's the authoritarian side of it. Tankies promote authoritarian views similar to fascists but with a different economics view (not even that different some times), hence they prefer the dictatorships like USSR (in these days even Putin, which is idiotic), North Korea, China; over what they perceive as imperialist, the USA (I agree on calling it imperialistic and disliking it, but not on considering it worse than dictatorships).
I'm a communist which likes state socialism, but what is and was present in those dictatorship (ignoring the authoritarian side which I despise) is state capitalism.
Thank you for taking the time to explain! I appreciate you!
Thanks for explaining for me, that's exactly what I meant, I just didn't have the time to reply!
The problem is not state socialism, it’s the authoritarian side of it
The communist utopia needs authoritarianism to work
Not really, communism is about owning the produce of your work, that can be achieved in different ways, one for example (the main one) is by democratising the work place, which at the moment is run in a feudal and authoritarian manner. Where you work and your employer owns what you do, similar to how the feudal system would function.
In this case communism would be more democratic than our current system.
The confusion comes from so much mass media that equates socialism with communism. They're orthogonal concepts! Saying socialism is the same as communism is like saying beer-making is exactly the same as cheese-making. Anyone who understands what beer and cheese are would be like, "I'm sorry, what‽"
The best way to think of socialism is that's it's a governance strategy that can be used wherever you want. Want everyone to pay taxes in order to fund and deliver government-run firefighting services? That's socialism. Want to do the same with the military? Socialism. Whenever the government is delivering some good or service by way of taxpayer dollars that's socialism.
Capitalism and communism are economic systems. You can have socialist government constructs under either capitalism or communism. It's just that communism doesn't really have the flexibility to provide goods or services in any other way than via the government.
Then there's countries like China that claim to be communist (and the Right loves to call them that) but really, they're more capitalist than communist. What they do have that most communists and fascist governments have is authoritarianism.
That authoritarianism is what fascists and "tankies" have in common: Fascists support an authoritarian, pseudo-capitalist government while "tankies" support an authoritarian, pseudo-communist government.
I appreciate your break down on this, I feel like I get so confused with auth/fasc terms
people who support Russia/Stalin/China regimes.
Congratulations: That, and only that, is a tankie. It is a good practical defintion for the term.
Are tankies people who are economically left but socially and politically right
As I see it, tankies are just the same as the Trumpers. You can't really say where they stand socially and politically, because they do not have a coherent opinion or ideology. Everyone who opposes their favorite regime is WRONG, and everything their favorite regime does is RIGHT. Bonus points for every action and opinion that hurts "woke lefties", because the favorite regimes of tankies are all inevitably incompatible with progressive ideas and ideologies.
without knowing anything about the corrupt oligarchies in Russia or CCP China?
Imagine the answer a Trumper would give when you ask them if they don't know about Trump's corruption and character. The tankies answer just the same in response to allegations in regard to corruption and character of their favorite regimes:
First of all, none of that is true, because the woke lefties, the media, and everyone are all corrupt, and lying. And what is true, is all a well played move of brilliant 5D chess which will save us all, because the supposed "corruption" is actually all part of a very smart and deliberate system of ploys and strategems which the woke lefties just don't understand.
Now, do the tankies and Trumpers truly believe that? Who knows. Doesn't really matter anyway. What is clear is that both of those "ideologies" are dumb idiots.
They're authoritarian. Not fascist. There is a difference. Even if both groups are more dedicated to authoritarianism than anything else. I would not be caught dead voluntarily anywhere with a fascist. While I disagree heavily with ML communist I might associate with them a little bit. But just never give them power.
Thanks for not leaving out the anarchists
I don't think you understand how small of a global majority white European men are.
Most leftists are Chinese.
I'd say most people are Chinese, but that's not correct - a quarter of the world's population is East Asian. This is the largest group in the world.
So, I'd say that's an odd quantifier that doesn't really seem to have any support or credibility or relevance. Seems based on entirely nothing, actually. Further more, were that true or even possible, what's your point?
Basically authoritarian leftists that are caricaturized as worshipping the Soviet Union
Thinks Stalin was cool and Lenin was correct to break the short lived democracy of the USSR. The rest is details.
People who cheer when others point out flaws in USA but start screaming when flaws in Russia or China are pointed out.
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Thanks! I thought it was Lemmy specific slang.
Nah it's been going on for probably more than a decade
Makes sense. I may have heard the term once or twice before, but here, I come across it almost daily.
I gotcha
The super rich are usually highly educated but they live in such a homogenous bubble that they’re opinions on the majority of society should be entirely discounted. They usually have a total lack of empathy for people and vote for politicians with the same attitude. I have met some super rich people who try very hard to go against the grain and not fall into that mindset, but something about the need for protecting your money and lifestyle usually promotes an untrustworthy and skeptical view of everyone in their lives including their own family.
Perfectly summed up.
Your username/instance combo is amazing. 10/10
That instance is epic lol .uk
lol, thanks
I think I might want to jump over to lemmyf.uk myself.
Is there a citizenship requirement? Do I have to prove that I find Daleks irrationally terrifying?
I do actually, because they all have Englishmen inside them. I kid, I'm Canadian. Scottish Canadian. Fuckin' wanker. Haha. I love you guys.
No requirements. Just don’t be an ass. 🙂
The political vibe on Lemmy isn't really a new thing. Reddit had it 15 years ago. Good forums and IRC channels had it before that. It's been part of the "golden age" of every online social medium
Eventually, teenage edgelords find start taking up too much space. Shortly after that, the far-right turn up to prey on them.
The people who made the platform good in the first place leave and the cycle begins anew.
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Theres a difference. While nerds are often book smart, we often have social difficulties.
Just cause I’m a nerd dusnt mean I can spell correctly
“tens”
“You can tell by the grammar, the spelling”
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Lol! I am totally a nerd
Do you realise how dehumanising and ignorant you're being? You're just using stereotypes of your specific country to generalise everyone you disagree with.
Underestimating your "rivals" never goes well, as reality is often more complex than "we empathetic genuises they dumb psychos"
If anyone is basing their morals specifically just to go against their "rivals", I would seriously question that person's ethics, empathy, and reasoning skills. I'm absolutely serious about that. I would not trust that person in real life.
I would also have little sympathy for anyone who makes their own life worse just to get one in on their "rivals". You should always think how a new law might expand in 5-10 years, and not just focus on the current emotions.
If someone who you considered to be a truly terrible person got into power next, would you feel comfortable with those groundwork protections being seen as changeable? Would you be ok with that terrible person having that level of say over your life, knowing that they would get away with it?
If you hypothetically start messing with things like your country's ground-level human rights, it's likely to only be a matter of time until everyone is effected by it in unpleasant ways. Everyone thinks these changes will magically stop before it hits them, but I would strongly recommend for these people to brush up on history again. How has that gone in the past?
Politics shouldn't be some lame "gotcha" game because politics effect the real lives of many people. If anyone wants to do "gotcha" games, there are many places for those that won't possibly end with someone dead. That "someone" may be a stranger today, but it could be your child, spouse, or best friend next time.
Ah, I forgot you're probably American.
Then forget about what I said, you're ruled by a party with two colors, two letters and stupid followers
Not even close. Do you project this anger on complete strangers all the time?
I was referring to things like labor law changes. It's fine when it's someone else to a lot of people, but those people are silly to think that their jobs would be the one exclusion.
Not even close? Bro Biden is at most a little more center-leaning than Trump
I'm not in the US haha.
I don't vote based on parties or teams. I vote for the changes that I want to see.
Dumb fag. Reddit used to be apolitical.
lol when was it apolitical? As far back as 2010 it was getting mentioned on TV by liberal media for starting the Restoring Truthiness movement.
Your memory is awful, or you haven't been on it that long and are just making up its history to suit yourself. The earlier days of reddit's politics were mostly liberal. Although liberals were significantly more awful on social issues back then than they are today.
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It's not the tech nerds funding the right wing; it's the venture capitalists
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Those are CEOs.
There's a huge contingent of socialist/leftist techies. How do you think the open source movement happened? The most popular operating system for both servers and smartphones is given away to the world by a .org
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Silicon Valley is notorious for right-wingers
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I'm not saying there are no right-wing tech nerds, I'm saying that your argument that tech nerds are right wing is overly reductive.
You concede my point about FOSS but then try to muddy the waters from there by citing "their platforms started getting cracked down on and [their having] adopted cryptocurrency" to try to make your prior pidgeon-holing still work. Mind citing me a source for either of those claims? Neither of those seem to me to be issues plaguing the wider FOSS community, and as a participant I'm interested to hear about this news I've apparently missed.
Silicon Valley is not representative of tech nerds in general. It is, like Hollywood, a small area filled with desperate people trying to turn their talents into fame and fortune. Insinuating that tech nerds in general have the same culture as Silicon Valley is like insinuating that actors in general dress, act, and think like Hollywood actors do. It's ridiculous on its face.
All this to say it really sounds like you've built up a stereotype based on what you read in the news rather than by engaging with the actual community in question.
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It's my industry, but thanks.
Do your coworkers know what you think about them? My coworkers do because I respect the hell out of them.
It's my industry too.
I wasn't asking if right-wingers love crypto, but about what you were arguing about the FOSS community having "their platforms ... getting cracked down on and [their having] adopted cryptocurrency", which sounds an awful lot like a specific claim or two.
I literally still have no idea which events you're referring to, unless you're just saying "but crypto exists". I mean, we're on a FOSS platform right now.
Nice strawman, though. Honestly pretty ironic that you're implicitly accusing me of arguing in bad faith when you've misrepresented my question so entirely.
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I asked you to establish the truth value of your claims about the FOSS community 1) adopting crypto and 2) being cracked down on. That's not sealioning. I genuinely had no idea what you were talking about and I'm in the FOSS community.
Even with this correction I think you're maybe referring to RedHat being shitty with regards to going corporate, which is a bit silly since they've always been the corporate-friendly for-profit Linux company. I mean it is worse than it had been but it's hardly indicative of a trend across the entire community.
I honestly still have no idea what you're alluding to WRT the FOSS community adopting crypto, though. Blockchain stuff I get, it was a trendy technology and IPFS is neat and all, but I've seen no trend towards cryptocurrency in the general FOSS community. Like what, did Apache mint some NFTs? Tell me what you're alluding to so I can Google it, even, if you're too lazy to send me a link.
Your strawman (from my perspective) was the reframing of my request as needing proof that "right-wingers love crypto projects" which was not what I was asking about at all. You decided that I was sealioning because I called bullshit on your claims about trends in the FOSS community, from my perspective. That seemed to me an awful lot like misrepresenting my argument in order to dismiss it out of hand, so, y'know, a strawman.
overwhelmingly tech dudes with no social competencies.
Ablism, real nice.
I am really not liking what you are throwing down and I am not seeing evidence of your multiple assertions. I am fairly leftwing, been an engineer for 15 years, I don't enjoy dealing with companies that are run by rightwingers but I am not going to do a purity test.
Stop with the discrimination against the high functioning autistic at least. I am sorry your glowing rectangle provider who let you unlock it but that is hardly our fault.
i'm high functioning; so maybe that's why i don't understand how people get triggered by broad brush statements. what made you think that this statement was ablism instead of a simple broad brush?
Your question is why I considered a sweeping generalization about a group of people to be bigoted?
Just clarifying here. You are confused about why assigning a stereotype to people based on genetic traits came off as bigotry.
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Oh your feelings were hurt after you stereotyped me? Boo freaken hoo
I am not an incel. I have been with my wife for 13 years. My eldest is 9. Before I met her I did more than alright in dating, thank you very much.
I am not right-wing. I consider myself a centralist but in practice I vote democratic the vast majority of the time.
I have never found crypto to be impressive but yeah I do have a few hundred in it because meh why not? I bought 20 bucks worth years ago and didn't sell.
As I explained to you I don't exactly get veto power over my clients and I am not in a position where I can storm off when Koch comes by with an order. If you want a fucking purity test go work for that overpriced ice cream place in Vermont. Just don't come crying to me when they make you watch videos about issues you disagree with. I live in the real world where it isn't realistic to only do business with people who 100% agree with me on every issue and have never ever done something wrong.
It's funny how you demand this from me but wouldn't yell at some guy working at a McDonald's for filling Cheney's order. Shows how consistent you are but demand that I be more consistent. Hypocrisy.
Must be nice on that high horse. You go enjoy yourself. I am going to deal with the real world, warts and all.
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i didn't think you were being an ablist either and, since it pertains to me, i wanted to understand why the other person thought you were being an ablist.
incel also pertains to me because i'm convinced that if i were straight, it would perfectly describe me. however the name/title is clearly sourced from some sort of privileged condescension since it's meant as an insult and i can't apply to people like me in name only; do you have any links you can share so i can read up on that pipeline?
I wouldn't call them nerds because they're venture capitalists not nerds. Nerds implies some sort of technological or engineering skill or ability. Steve Jobs would qualify; not these two.
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I think you dont know what luck is.
....I am not funding the right wing. I am building a better world one line of code and one circuit at a time.
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Well first off software isn't just flowing rectangles connected to internet tubes. Many of us work in Industrial/Chemical/Civil control systems. Like me. There is a lot of thought that goes into making sure what you flush doesn't just pour on the ground. I made a decision early in my career that it was more important to me that we don't drown in our own waste vs making sure slack integrated well with outlook.
As for how I would go about changing stuff the answer is I do it everyday. Can do it a lot faster if the rest of you people stayed the hell out of my way.
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Praise after attacking me means nothing.
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Get off the wrong internet spaces and you'll start meeting the right kinds of nerds.
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If it smells like shit everywhere you go, change your shoes.
Are those groups right wing, or just centrists that don't react well to people trying to push far left ideals in their spaces?
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Just very, very rightist.