5mo ago

How should I continue learning?

I begun learning programming a few years ago, and it feels like I barely progressed. I know the basics and a bit of advanced python(I have learnt to use a few libraries), html and css plus a tiny bit of c++, but not much outside of those. I enjoy programming and solving problems using code, and it’s an enjoyable hobby of mine. But I feel like all I do is extremely basic and I want to advance but it feels overwhelming seeing the countless of things I could learn.

I wanna know what are ways I can actually apply the things I have learnt/will learn on somewhat worthwhile things, because the main problem right now is that I don’t really have anything to do with the things I’ve learnt other than silly projects that don’t really last more than a day and aren’t that complex. I also want to advance my knowledge as previously stated since I feel like I know too little for the amount of time I’ve been learning to program.

For context I’m still in school but not too far off from higher ed, and I have a decent amount of free time on most days(~2-4 hrs).

Thanks if you reply

34 comments

Its a tough problem. You have to find something that you want to exist; like an app or a website or a game. For example, try making a GUI for managing SSH keys. You know, like the ones github makes you create in order to clone and push to a repo. Make a visual representation of those keys (stored in the .ssh folder), and tools to add/delete them.
Along the way you'll find tons of missing things, tools that should exist but don't. Those are the "real" projects that will really expand your capabilities as a developer.
For example, I was coding in python and wanted to make a function that caches the output because the code was inherently slow.
but to cache an output we need to know the inputs are the same
hashes are good for this but lists can't be hashed with the built-in python hash function
we can make our own hash, but hashing a list that contains itself is hard
there is a solution for lists, but then hashing a set that contains itself is a serious problem (MUCH harder than hashing a list)
turns out hashing a set is the same problem as the graph-coloring problem (graph isomorphism)
suddenly I have a really deep understanding of recursive data structures all because I wanted to a function that caches its output.

This consternation is definitely common. It's hard to apply skills to something with no long term impact of benefit. I've improved my skills by finding stuff I can help on in the communities I participate in.
It's natural to be overwhelmed, so deciding on a project does scope what you can learn, but a hard part is architecting the foundation of that project.
Introducing new features to an existing project is a great way to get your feet wet - it has multiple benefits, for one of you do take a position as a developer in the future, you likely won't be architecting anything initially, primarily improving on existing projects. So participating in OSS projects is a similar mechanism to that - you have to learn their codebase to a degree, you have to learn their style and requirements, etc.
Even if you don't ultimately contribute, it's still a learning experience.

To take up a career in programming is to be professionally confused on a day-to-day basis. It's normal to feel overwhelmed at times, but this is the advice I give younger engineers: accept that confusion, and try to channel it into curiosity instead of letting it fester into stress and anxiety.

Try to replicate software/apps you use everyday. Not to improve them, but to figure out how they work. In addition to learning how they work, you'll learn the problems the original devs had to solve, and one way to solve them.
- In addition to your comment, I would add to include apps that don’t sound “as interesting” or different from your usual picks. Along the way, it helps to be willing to refactor if you see a different way to implement it. This can help turn a routine task into a more interesting challenge.

It's a lot of work. I'm in a similar boat. I've been self teaching myself how to program in various languages and working as a Fullstack developer at a very small startup.
While I've learned alot, there's always more to learn and finding direction is a challenge you'll hit many times over if you stick with it.
Right now I'm reviewing various Open Source Projects I could contribute to as I know ultimately this will make me a much better developer. There are so many CLI and web development tools I use that I'd like to expand on but will require a marginal jump in my skills. Here are a few examples:
Add a feature to the rTorrent client that would allow it to torrent over i2p
Expand the amount of tools available within the SolidJS framework ecosystem to be competitive with React's ecosystem.
Create a HTTP server in Rust that has feature parity with Golang's Caddy
Add a feature to AntennaPod akin to YouTube Sponsor block that would allow for user contributed timestamps to facilitate auto skipping of ad mentions in podcast episodes.
I also am slowly working out plans to learn enough about Rust and browsers to recreate the terminal based browser Links in Rust.
But these are all just me spitballing. In truth, my skills aren't quite there yet and the amount of time to get there for each one of these is a lot. So I have to choose wisely and dive in deep on the project's codebase, probably for at least a year or more to make headway. But this is the mindset I think might help you. Look into the software you use a lot or like the concept of. Figure out how you'd like to improve it or add to it. Reach out to the developers of said software however you can, either make your case for the improvements you want to make or just help out on something they want to do with the software. Learn, listen. Rinse and repeat.
Hope this helps a bit.

If you want to improve significantly, go read someone else's code and modify it. Try to fix a bug in a program you use, add a feature you want that doesn't exist already, or even just do something simple for the sake of proving to yourself that you can do it -- like compiling it from source and figuring out how to change some small snippet of text in a message box. Even if you don't succeed, if you put in a serious effort attempting it, you will almost certainly learn a lot from trying.
Edit: changed wording to try to be clearer

Leetcode is a great way to polish your skills. When I was your age, I read programming books and made projects I cared about, it's turned out very well.
I've helped a few others learn programming, practice and working on any project at all always help more than anything.
- My friends Leetcoded and Codeforced quite a lot. Advent of Code is up there too, with the interesting caveat that Advent of Code also teaches you refactoring (due to the two-part nature of every problem).
  However, when I was younger I had contempt for the whiteboard-problem-esque appearances of these, but everyone is different.
  If you look hard enough there is always a project at medium difficulty -- not way too hard, like a huge project you feel won't give you returns -- not way too easy, like some cowsay clone. Ever tried making a blog? You can host for free on most Git pages implementations (codeberg, github, gitlab...).
  As for programming books, consider trying security books like Art of Exploitation -- in the same strain, CTFs can use a decent amount of code, and they're fun in terms of raw problem-solving. I started with the Bandit wargame, which does Linux problem solving from any machine that has SSH.
  I'm not by any means a l33t hax3r but I found them pretty fun in my learning journey.
  
  Codewars is a cool leetcode-esque thing with less of the corporate dystopia sheen.

Look at MIT and UC Berkeley's CS curricula and start tackling things that you haven't covered. They're both available freely online and you might still be able to find video recordings of Cal's lectures somewhere (they recorded every class for students who weren't present or had difficulty understanding in real time until 2015 or so but were hit with an ADA accessibility lawsuit because they weren't captioned or something.)

Read/Inspect and contribute to FOSS. They'll be bigger and longer lived than small, personal, and experimental projects.
Study computer science.
Work, preferably in an environment with mentors, and long-/continuously-maintained projects.
Look at alternative approaches and ecosystems. Like .NET (very good docs and guidance), a functional programming language, Rust, or Web.
That being said, you ask about "should", but I think if it's useful for personal utilities that's good enough as well. Depends on your interest, goals, wants, and where you want to go in the future.
For me, managing my clan servers and website, reading online, and contributing to FOSS were my biggest contributors to learning and expertise.
- Seconding the FOSS advice from the perspective of a fellow learner.
  I'm a scientist first and foremost, so I'm learning programming on the side. A lot of code that's written by scientists is pretty grim, so attempting to understand and contribute to FOSS projects has been useful in understanding how a complex project is organised, and how to read code as well as write it.
  Contributing can be pretty small, even opening a git issue for a problem, or adding some info to an existing issue. You won't be able to just dive in and start solving problems all over, and it can feel overwhelming to try as a relative beginner, but it massively improved my skills.

Multi-Account Containers extension is looking for more contributors
https://lemm.ee/post/43431167
https://github.com/mozilla/multi-account-containers/discussions/2672
- This is me wondering.. is there anyone who curates and categorizes lists of open source projects actively looking for contributions? Possibly with an organization based on experience level? It’s often hard to tell what project are active enough that entry, intermediate, or experienced level help is needed and for what.

I like to pick a fun project, pick a language I don’t know / wanna learn better, and then just go for it. Don’t be discouraged if somebody’s already made it - nothing says your learning project has to be useful in the real world, tho it’s kinda nice if you think of something that can be. If your project seems intimidatingly hard, remember the programmer workflow of breaking it down into manageable pieces and tackling those. If it doesn’t seem hard enough to teach you anything, I sometimes like to write it without using any external code or libraries (or a minimum of them; if it’s something like a GUI program I’ll use direct vulkan bindings instead of like Qt). This is also one of the few areas I get some use out of LLMs, cuz bullying ChatGPT or a local equivalent into giving me huge and tailored lists of program ideas can be really helpful. Either way my main advice is just to pick something that interests you and have fun with it; things don’t have to be worthwhile to other people to be worthwhile to you.

I found reading through the rust book was a nice walkthrough of problems one can hit and how that language elected to solve them.
In terms of practice:
Write a vim config
Shell out to python if you'd like
Learn a bit of elisp and org-mode
Rewrite all your shell scripts into a python CLI
Write a pyqt6 GUI for tasks and notes on the exact way you've always wanted it to work
Write an AI tool to auto-format links etc with phi3
Very exciting how much these smaller models can do!

You need to think of things you might want to build. Try building software that nobody ever has, try fixing issues in current software using git. You can find lots of python program in GitHub, waiting for contributions. That's how I learnt. If you want to learn and use C++, try building software that interacts with the real world with Arduino, try contributing to the Linux kernel or try making simple games using C++ in Godot.
- I did actually make a game in godot but it was mostly based on a tutorial and little of my own inpuy
  
  Then use what you learnt from that tutorial and make something similar or entirely new, without tutorials.

Join in on your school clubs and research projects, or start some with friends!
There are many great competitions where previous programming experience would come in handy.
One competition that takes place in the U.S.:
NASA Student Launch
It actually IS rocket science! Student Launch is a 9-month long challenge that tasks student teams from across the U.S. to design, build, test, and launch a high-powered rocket carrying a scientific or engineering payload. It is a hands-on, research-based, engineering activity and culminates each year with a final launch in Huntsville, Alabama home of NASA’s Marshall Space Flight Center. The activity offers multiple challenges reaching a broad audience colleges and universities as well as middle and high school aged students across the nation.^[[1] https://www.nasa.gov/learning-resources/nasa-student-launch/]
Culminating Event Dates: April 30 – May 4, 2025
Culminating event location: Huntsville, AL
Eligibility: Open to U.S. Students
Grade Levels: Grades 6-12, College and University
- I do not live in the US so I unfortunately cannot join that competition. Not sure if my friends and I can commit ourselves to a project but we’ll try.
  
  There are many competitions that are open to people outside the US, so I would check others out if you are interested in rockets!
  Here is another: https://www.soundingrocket.org/sa-cup-home.html | https://www.soundingrocket.org/2024-sa-cup.html
  Teams that competed last year from outside the United States:
  Mexico
  Philippines
  Canada
  Thailand
  United Kingdom
  Turkey
  Algeria
  Brazil
  India
  Argentina
  Romania
  Germany
  Australia
  Spain
  New Zealand
  Poland
  2024 Team List (Last updated 6-11-24 acb): [https://www.soundingrocket.org/uploads/9/0/6/4/9064598/published_team_list_061124.xlsx_-_for_output.pdf]

Does your school have a robotics team or something along the lines of computing? That would be a good option. Also if you are still in high school and plan on going to college, you still have plenty of time to learn.

You can try to write programs you think would be a challenge for you (but still doable at your skill level). Write some games, bots that solve simple games like Tic Tac Toe or mods for your favourite (moddable) games. If you own a Raspberry Pi you could play around with the DPIO. Your free time projects are usually nothing too exciting or world-changing and that’s perfectly fine, they don’t have to be; the worthwhile part about them will be the practice they’ll offer.
Alternatively, you could try reading some theory, learn different types of data structures, sorting algorithms or pathfinding algorithms and their respective strengths and weaknesses. Or go deeper and prepare for higher Edu in CS by looking into the maths fundamentals, learn some linear algebra, discrete math, analysis or basic graph theory, it will help you a lot.
Edit: graph theory, not knot theory

The way I did it is by trying to solve more and more advanced problems with simpler tools/features, then looking at more advanced features and seeing where they could be applied to make the problem solving simpler. Rinse and repeat.
An easy example that I can remember is making arrays that dynamically expand. I started with the barebones malloc and worked out how to use std::vector (and other list types) in its place.
Understanding that concept is, what I believe, to be the foundation of learning programming.
I'm no pro whatsoever, but using this method really helps me pick up and learn new languages.

Obligatory Linux comment (Lemmy moment):
Windows is used often for its compatibility and defaultness but Linux is interesting in the sense that everything is patchable, everything is tinkerable and configurable. The low resistance to tinkering makes lots of Linux users tinkerers -- including tinkering via code.
I'm not saying wipe your hard drive or even dual-boot. Maybe an older computer or VM could help, depending on what you have. But just in the past week I've screwed around in low-to-medium-difficulty Linux projects that configured my lockscreen with C, that implemented mildly usable desktop GUIs with TypeScript, among others -- just not-too-committal stuff that has a return value I literally see every time I lock my computer.
Windows equivalent projects can be harsher on the beginning-to-intermediate curve (back when I first tried out Linux Mint, I'd been struggling to make a bookmark inspector in Visual Studio -- ended up Pythoning it instead) -- not to say that Windows fun is by any means out-of-reach.

I propose you contribute to Foss software that you use.
With that you are motivated because you are invested in the project, you will see the effect of your work and you learn about the process of contributing and working in a team.
That should keep you going for a while. Best of luck.

As others have said, keep finding and building projects for yourself. Maybe get this book if you don't have ideas of things you can build: Exercises for Programmers: 57 Challenges to Develop Your Coding Skills

You could try to find an open source project to contribute to? That'll get give you a nice big codebase to grapple with.

I think what you need is inspiration, there's so many things to build to improve your skills and broaden your knowledge. Not every project you work on needs to be novel and exciting, even basic things can provide ample complexity to learn new things.
For example, in c++ you can make a basic image viewer that takes the name of a file and displays it, using some library like SDL (or OpenGl/Vulkan(hard)). This would teach you a lot about file formats, dynamic memory allocation and managing it, graphics pipeline etc.
For html and css, you can try to recreate some cool websites you see online. I hope this gives an inspiration(best viewed on PC).
For problem solving there's always leet code, advent of code and other similar services.
Here's more stuff to get started

I thought this old antirez "mythical 10x programmer" post was pretty good:
http://antirez.com/news/112

If you want that sweet dopamine hit of solving problem with out the overhead of doing a project just try leet code. Like that Chinese ping pong player. Nothing wrong with that if you are not gonna pursue it as a job. Ps. You can use different language then you are familiar with like Haskell or ocamel. It can really help you think differently and look problems in new light.

You can't. You either go into work and learn to solve complex problems or pivot to something else. For me it was the latter, I'm IT brainlet now,, but every time I come back to brushing up on programming there's like no middle ground with projects, I don't have the time or really energy to commit to building a 3D video game engine in C or an OS, and learning pointer arithmetic for multiple iterators all just to make a palindrome checker CLI feels lame and building a clone of Spotify but in some new webdev thing of the week to some tutorial is hard to be excited about.

34 comments