!vegan@lemmy.world mod suppresses criticisms of fediverse spam campaign, using mass ban technique to silence opposing viewpoints

The modlog should at least contain an identifier of the mod. Maybe not a link to their account but something that can be tracked across communities. To see who is abusing their power.

I'm pretty it's Beaver. I'm now banned (and I appear to be blocked by Beaver as well) and I'm pretty sure the only recent direct interaction I've had with the community was downvoting the recent articles about how vegan diets are okay for carnivorous pets.
- Yeah, beaver is a bit batshit lol
- They went batshit with the meme posting last night and the threads were mostly shitting on them. They are full tilt.
  Yup just checked, banned.

Modlog does contain the info, it's just not displayed on the website. You can get the full data from lemmy API

Example:

    
{
            "mod_ban_from_community": {
                "id": 19651,
                "mod_person_id": 7121342,
                "other_person_id": 8043739,
                "community_id": 1309,
                "reason": "Rule 5",
                "banned": true,
                "expires": "2024-09-19T21:03:47Z",
                "when_": "2024-09-12T21:05:15.205847Z"
            },
            "moderator": {
                "id": 7121342,
                "name": "Beaver",
                "display_name": "Beaver [she/her]",
                "avatar": "https://lemmy.ca/pictrs/image/5801e891-c371-459d-a262-84e476040930.png",
                "banned": false,
                "published": "2024-04-11T00:47:49.008680Z",
                "actor_id": "https://lemmy.ca/u/Beaver",
                "bio": "Human/Animal Rights Supporter \n\n🇵🇸🇺🇦🇹🇼🇬🇪🏳️‍🌈🏳️‍⚧️🇲🇩\n\nWe Need Proportional Representation Badly\n",
                "local": false,
                "banner": "https://lemmy.ca/pictrs/image/fea3cd18-4600-49b1-a0b9-be394adeab83.jpeg",
                "deleted": false,
                "matrix_user_id": "@ralimbahere:matrix.org",
                "bot_account": false,
                "instance_id": 251
            },
            "community": {
                "id": 1309,
                "name": "vegan",
                "title": "vegan",
                "description": "Please also check out [vegantheoryclub.org](https://vegantheoryclub.org/) for a great set of well-run communities for vegan news, cooking, gardening, and art. It is not federated with LW, but it is a nice, cozy, all-in-one space for vegans.\n\n***\n\nWe ask that the you have an understanding on what veganism is before engaging in this community.\n\nIf you think you have been banned erroneously, please get in contact with one of the other mods for appeals.\n\nModerator reports may not federate properly and may delay moderator action. Please DM an active mod if an abusive comment remains after reporting it.\n\n***\n\n## Welcome\n\nWelcome to c/vegan@lemmy.world. Broadly, this community is a place to discuss veganism. Discussion on [intersectional](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intersectionality) topics related to the animal rights movement are also encouraged.\n\n## What is Veganism?\n\n> 'Veganism is a philosophy and way of living which seeks to exclude—as far as is possible and practicable—all forms of exploitation of, and cruelty to, animals ...'\n\n— abridged definition from [The Vegan Society](https://www.vegansociety.com/go-vegan/definition-veganism)\n\n## Rules\n\n*The rules are subject to change, especially upon community feedback.*\n\n1. Discrimination is **not** tolerated. *This includes [speciesism](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speciesism)*.\n2. Topics not relating to veganism are subject to removal.\n3. Posts are to be as accessible as practicable:\n\t- pictures of text require alt-text;\n\t- paywalled articles must have an accessible non-paywalled link.\n4. Content warnings are required for triggering content.\n5. Bad-faith [carnist](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carnism) rhetoric &amp; anti-veganism are not allowed, as this is not a space to debate the merits of veganism. Anyone is welcome here, however, and so good-faith efforts to ask questions about veganism may be given their own weekly stickied post in the future (see current stickied discussion).\n\t- before jumping into the community, we encourage you to read [examples of common fallacies here.](https://yourveganfallacyis.com/)\n\t- if you're asking questions about veganism, be mindful that the person on the other end is trying to be helpful by answering you and treat them with at least as much respect as they give you.\n6. Misinformation, particularly that which is dangerous or has malicious intent, is subject to removal.\n\n## Resources on Veganism\n\nA compilation of many vegan resources/sites in a Google spreadsheet:\n\n* [vegancheatsheet.org](https://vegancheatsheet.org/)\n\nHere are some documentaries that are recommended to watch if planning to or have recently become vegan:\n\n* [You Will Never Look at Your Life in the Same Way Again](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z3u7hXpOm58)\n* [Dominion (2018)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LQRAfJyEsko) (CW: gore, animal abuse)\n\n## Vegan Fediverse\n\nLemmy: [vegantheoryclub.org](https://vegantheoryclub.org/)\n\nMastodon: [veganism.social](https://veganism.social/)\n\n### Other Vegan Communities\n\n#### General Vegan Comms\n!vegan@lemmy.ml\n\n!vegan@hexbear.net\n\n!vegan@vegantheoryclub.org\n\n!vegan@slrpnk.net\n\n#### Circlejerk Comms\n!vegancirclejerk@lemmy.ml\n\n\n#### Vegan Food / Cooking\n!homecooks@vegantheoryclub.org \n\n!veganrecipes@sh.itjust.works\n\n!recipes@vegantheoryclub.org\n\n",
                "removed": false,
                "published": "2023-06-09T20:05:49.639993Z",
                "updated": "2024-09-03T01:09:32.860483Z",
                "deleted": false,
                "nsfw": false,
                "actor_id": "https://lemmy.world/c/vegan",
                "local": true,
                "icon": "https://lemmy.ca/pictrs/image/22056785-18ee-40dc-a6da-03af986f2d3b.jpeg",
                "hidden": false,
                "posting_restricted_to_mods": false,
                "instance_id": 1
            },
            "banned_person": {
                "id": 8043739,
                "name": "mushroomstormtrooper",
                "banned": false,
                "published": "2024-05-27T16:10:30.690962Z",
                "actor_id": "https://lemmy.world/u/mushroomstormtrooper",
                "local": true,
                "deleted": false,
                "bot_account": false,
                "instance_id": 1
            }
        }

Nice.. thanks. I had indeed just checked the website. I think it should then just be on the website. Especially if they are exposing votes then open this up too.
- Yeah it's weird it just says 'mod' or 'admin' instead of the username
  
  It's because people abused mods who banned them and such. I kinda get it.
  
  Transparency for thee....
  
  Yeah..

Thunder shows the mod for each modlog action.
The info is there. You can tell who it is by using the filters (e.g. logs filtered on me as the user that were modded by beaver: https://lemmy.world/modlog?page=1&modId=7121342&userId=36)
It’s a pain in the ass but it works.
The modlog should at least contain an identifier of the mod. Maybe not a link to their account
It should contain link to their profile. People should be accountable for the consequences of their actions.
- Yeah, agreed

Yeah vegans should not consider themselves as a minority.

The ANIMALS are the minority group. Not YOU. The entitlement speaks to an ego trip and is a vicious representation of the cause.

They should have their platform removed because they are hurting the image of the vegan movement

This is coming from a vegan btw

The ANIMALS are the minority group. Not YOU.
relevant xkcd
- To be fair, minority in the sense that there is a power imbalance between us humans, the majority, and domesticated animals, the minority.

I was curious, so I had a look, seems like it still leads to violence in some occurences

A Florida man was recently arrested for allegedly stabbing his cousin after a heated debate about whether whole cow's milk or almond milk is superior.

The debate over whether to consume animal products, like meat and dairy, or go entirely plant-based (vegan) is a hot-button issue, often filled with vitriol and name-calling online and in real life.

https://www.businessinsider.com/why-do-angry-vegans-meat-eaters-fight-so-much-2020-2?op=1

Yeah, but c'mon, that's Floridaman. He's a meth head who'd murder someone because he wanted to fuck an alligator and thought he needed a human sacrifice to do it.
- Whoa now! Don't tarnish the good name of alligator fuckers like that!
  
  Alligator lovers
  
  Hey, the lovers are okay in my book too
I don't think that counts as targeted hate crime or whatever. He wasn't stabbed for veganism, he was stabbed from the heated argument, which by trigger happy dumbos like these could have been about anything.

I'm not a vegan or even a vegetarian, but even I can see that my vegetarian friends get questioned uncomfortably all the time for their diet choice. When you do something differently, you inevitably get bullied.

I used to be a vegetarian for a decade and then a pescetarian before apathy fully set in and I saw how pointless it all is.
Vegans and vegetarians can be some of the most judgemental gatekeeping assholes out there. Many of them aren't, but the ones that are militant and overbearing are the worst and only push others from their cause. Those ones desperately want to feel better than others, so become borderline eating disordered to elevate themselves to some holy god level in their minds because they eat beans and lentils.
They aren't in the same class as minorities. They choose to eat the diet they do. And no one can visibly tell they are vegetarian/vegan until they tell others they are.
- They are not in the same situation as minorities, but if they stay true to their ideals, they get bullied just like minorities. The fact there are assholes among them just like in any other group of people changes nothing.
  
  Getting bullied is not the same as being a "MINORITY". White kids who are not minorities in North America but get bullied all the time in school. Not eating flesh of a mammal or fish etc doesn't mean you are a "minority". Like I said, I've experienced life as a veggie. Is it annoying? The stupid questions, the comments people make? Yes. But I've never had a cop pull me over and worry about whether I'll die that day because I don't eat beef. Or worry, walking down the street, alone at night as a single woman, if I'll be assaulted because I don't eat chicken. Non-meat-eaters aren't minorities in the sense that they are discriminated against in the idea that the word "minority" conjures up. They deal with, at most, someone tricking them into eating meat. Which I've had done. It felt violating and offensive but wasn't any sort of level as someone who is an actual "minority" in our continent.
  
  As I think about it though, the word minority now mosty means an ethnical minority. But when mentioning women - although discriminated against, they're not a minority in the original sense at all - there is usually the same number of women and men, the problems lie elsewhere. In this sense of the word, vegans are a minority in our society. They could be compared to religious minorities, I guess. It's a choice, but a choice based on ethical foundations, so going against this choice is unthinkable for those people without being untrue to themselves and betraying what they believe in.
  
  Okay, I can really understand what you are trying to say. I feel like there needs to be a different or new word for this kind of experience maybe? Because choosing to abstain from a food group or what have you doesn't make your minority in the sense most of us think of, even if it's technically correct. And we don't want to minimize what true minorities go through when our food choices in this case our truly our own choice. But it is definitely a different experience when someone finds out you choose not to eat the type of food they do. They take it so personally you are not eating meat. I actually had the same issues when I was doing Atkins ages ago, which is mostly protein based. People questioning my food choices because it wasn't what they they eat and they took it as a personal judgement against them.
  
  I didn't want to say it was the same. Just that they do get bullied.
  
  Yeah sorry if I got a bit heated in my response. Maybe I misunderstood your point.

Most people aren't vegan, so vegans are a minority. That's not difficult to understand, so we have to assume you're reading in bad faith. Stop it please.

Edit: veganism isn't a diet either. Quite easy to find this out if you even stick the word into a search engine.

This might be a language barrier thing, but in most english-speaking countries when you use the term "minority" to refer to a group of people, that typically refers to a group who is a minority based on race, sex, ethnicity, gender or some other inherent trait. You might say, "a small community" to refer to a group within a group, but you wouldn't say, "a minority community" for that unless you were trying to imply that the community in question was a racial, ethnic, gender, or other form of minority.
- What about "vocal minority"?
  
  I have seen the word used in both ways, though I think that in this case the user was intending to use it to imply oppression, rather than simply meaning that they do not have a lot of users.
  
  While you have a point, my immediate reaction was, "oh cool, now they're trying to do it too" (I've seen tankies claim the same shit). When I probe my brain to try and figure out why that was a response, the result is my brain telling me that I'm hearing some kind of dog whistle but it won't go into more detail about what makes that statement sound like a dog whistle.
  Tbh, considering how unhinged they're behaving (though at this point I think they're doing it for shits and giggles), I wouldn't be surprised if they truly meant it that way; it honestly wouldn't be the first time I've seen someone on here try to claim something like that. I suppose that doesn't mean they intended to mean it that way, now I'm curious if anyone else had a similar interpretation. I'm used to hearing people referring to racial, or gender, or ethnic minorities when they say something like, "I'm part of a misunderstood minority group"; and I know I've heard people from other english-speaking countries (other than the US) do it as well.
- No, English is my first language, and all I'm saying is that you could've interpreted it the other way, which is plausible at the end of the day, and it'd be true, which is what it means to read something charitably/in good faith.
To put the shoe on the other foot, how would it sound to you if someone on the Carnivore diet, or on the Atkins diet called themselves a minority?
It just doesn't make sense, because dietary choices, are just that, choices. While actual minorities, like POCs and LGBTQ people, are born the way they are. They don't have any choices in the matter.
Don't get me wrong, dietary choices can be a super serious matter, and I am not saying that people aren't discriminated against for them. I just think its wrong to call someone a minority based on any sort of dietary choice, at least in the same context that minority is usually used.
- Religion is a choice, does that make religious minorities not minorities? It's a strongly held ethical belief system.
  
  Religion, by itself, is normally not a qualifier when we refer to minorites, as that word normally implies an ethnic or racial minority. However, there are some religions with ethnicities tied to them, e.g. Jewish people, and Muslims, so the line can definitely become a bit blurred.
  Jewish people are a minority in most places because of their ethnicity, not their religion. Muslims are often referred to as minorities in most places, because most Muslims are ethnically related, at least as far as the Western world is concerned.
  Some also reuse the word minority interchangably to refer to religious minorities, political minorities, etc, which further blurs the line, but the most common use of the word is in reference to race or ethnicity.
- Again, veganism isn't a diet (this is painfully easy to find out if you just quickly look it up!) and if you interpret minority in a literal sense, it's true and relevant because it's easy to be overwhelmed by the majority if you're in the minority, which is what the person posting seems to be worried about.
  
  It's still a CHOICE. No one is born vegan; it's a position that someone arrives at.
  
  So is religion, theoretically at least.
  
  I agree with you. Unfortunately, the law does not. The law privileges religion as though it was inherent and immutable.
  
  I understand that Veganism is more than just a diet. Its a lifestyle, culture, pledge to a certain set of morals, etc. It can be as important as religion is to a devout religious person.
  A person on the Carnivore diet can make the same point. A person that subscribes to a political identity could also make your same point. This slippery slope leads to Nazis being able to call themselves minorities, because technically, Naziism is a culture, too, albeit a terrible one, and they are very thankfully in the minority of political beliefs.
  
  The difference being that nazis actually should be overwhelmed by the majority.
There are certainly vegan diets. People who still eat animal produce may still be interested in vegan alternatives without becoming vegan or vegetarian. And I don't think being part of a small community of a certain life choice isn't really making you a minority in the political sense (I assume that's what the minority part is trying to imply here, that there's some sort of entitlement for a minority protection).
Also, promoting vegan diets for carnivorous pets is indeed animal abuse and should not be defended or promoted. That's typically a telltale sign of veganazis, which are generally a terrible thing even for actual vegans as they put the whole lifestyle into a bad light with their overly aggressive rhetoric and disinformation.
- There are certainly vegan diets.
  Yes, and there are Muslim diets I'm sure, but Islam isn't a diet either, for example. Just stick "veganism" into your search engine of choice and the credible sources won't call it a diet.
  And I don’t think being part of a small community of a certain life choice isn’t really making you a minority in the political sense
  I'm arguing that they may not have meant that. The criticism should be "that's clumsy wording because it sounds like you mean minority in a political sense" or "surely you don't mean..." rather than "you're comparing yourself to (minorities in the political sense) and therefore vegans are bad".
  Also, ...
  Honestly, I suspect your willingness to assume the worst of what a vegan's said, and that you bring up a minority view even amongst vegans out of context, betrays a prejudgment that plays as much, if not more, of a role as how aggressively some vegans argue in how you're approaching the whole thing.
  
  Yes, and there are Muslim diets I'm sure, but Islam isn't a diet either, for example. Just stick "veganism" into your search engine of choice and the credible sources won't call it a diet.
  And there's surely people who are looking for traditional Muslim food without wanting to convert to Islam as well. Muslim's would probably treat people curious about their food less hostile than those vegans would.
  I suspect your willingness to assume the worst of what a vegan's said
  You can suspect that I assume the worst of any sort of human, especially when they constantly argue in bad faith and with hostile rhetoric. That being said, I don't approach vegans at all. I just observe the constant self righteous shit flinging they do from the outside, or get unwillingly caught up in it because they can't help but attack people even outside of their little radicalized bubbles.
  
  But then you're willingly admitting that you don't speak to enough vegans to have an informed idea of their ethos, which is something I wouldn't readily admit even if I did it. Not sure what your first point has to do with the matter at hand though.
  
  Not speaking to veganazis isn't the same as not speaking to vegans. Normal vegans I have no issues talking to.
  My first point is about the community that's about vegan food shunning those interested in vegan food because they're unwilling to talk to people who eat animal produce.
  
  I think you're going on a bit of a tangent I'm not interested in, sorry, but otherwise I'm not really following, and if you say things like "veganazis" it just reminds me of when people used to write "feminazis".
  
  If you cannot differentiate between feminists and feminazis either, then we have indeed nothing to talk about as you've sufficiently outed yourself as an extremist who does not aim for equality.
  
  You know the expression "big if"? I'm not sure you're following me either!