Do you allow transphobic mods?
Obviously reporting transphobic comments to a transphobic mod isn't going to result in any action, so I'm wondering if the admins are going to do anything about it?
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You know what? As a woman who’s had a sex change, I am so tired. I could not give a shit about this mods opinions or any of this topic from anybody.
It’s quite simply a topic that loses us support for emotional gut vibe reasons that have nothing to do with rationality. And for what?
I’ve never played women’s sports. Nobody trans I’ve ever met plays women’s sports because we’re all fucking afraid of it and always have been.
We are less than 1% of the population and of that 1% maybe 1% is anywhere near ballsy enough to even begin to try in this environment let alone having the resources to try competing on top of much more pressing matters like surgeries and hormones.
Are these people ignorant and on the wrong side of history here? Absolutely.
Have transsex people been playing sports for decades without issue and without dominating even one out of hundreds of different sports? Absolutely.
Are they just making shit up about transsex bodies based off nothing but unchecked stereotypes and ignorance because they only ever notice the most visible and non-passing ones and have no idea how many of us are stealth? 1000% you betcha.
Could whatever nuanced future issues be resolved by simply introducing additional classes according to measurable biological traits like weight or shoulder span in the few cases where perhaps one day there will be reason to? Yepppp.
Is this whole conversation actually just misogynistic control over women’s bodies that will ultimately harm quantitatively more cis women than trans women? Yep!! And they are better poised to tackle that than us when it does.
And yet? I want everybody to shut up about it because we have far more pressing issues at hand. When it comes to women’s sports the public has made up their mind and the facts don’t matter.
We’re losing access to life saving medical care, being deplatformed, and criminalized for existing in public and y’all still think this is about pointless debates over sports. The public does not have much bandwidth in their minds to spare on us & it’s imperative we get off this topic.
If someone thinks I’m a “biological male” who shouldn’t play women’s sports I don’t frankly care. As long as they don’t interfere with us building robust community organizations to ensure everybody has means to survive the Nazis in coming years, it’s fine.
Frankly they can call me a biological male all day if they want to deliver some hormones to a girl who needs them. They’d still be stupid and wrong but at least useful then.
If it's not sports it'll be something else.
This is a fallacy that treats all arguments as equal in the eyes of average people. But they are not.
The women’s sports attack is a bridge argument. They came after it because it’s a place where we lose. By replaying that loss over and over it serves to erode the general consensus on our rights, so that they can expand to other more radical positions later.
Arguing in that arena effectively builds the bridge with them even though your intentions may be pure.
It’s better instead to instead cut our losses and fight them on a topic very few people will disagree with us on. This builds consensus among the general population that we are on the right side of history. This burns down the bridge so they cannot cross it.
Women's sports are the main entryway for transphobic policymaking besides gender affirming care for minors. This is where they weasel in, this is where they normalize misgendering us and making bioessentialist claims that are the opposite of all the empirical evidence, this is how it starts. Not fighting back against sports bans is how we lost the American public on that front, it's how we lost the American public on even the meekest compromise measures like puberty blockers, now they're at striking down workplace discrimination protections and changing our documents. You do not get to pick and choose what's a losing issue here, ofc they'll start with the stuff that's easiest to paint as contentious. Amerikans gave in there, it was the start of how they lost that fight. This is all or nothing. You stand with all of the community, even a tiny minority of trans athletes, or you do not stand with any of us. Does that mean we'll win on all fronts? No, but we still have to resist on all fronts or we're fucked. Do not give a single inch just because you personally don't care or think you're personally not affected, this is part of a bigger struggle and you're not equipped to fight it if you don't fix that.
I think the trans women who are passionate about their sport disagree with you. Why would you just be okay with letting someone literally lose their hobby or even career over their gender? It's dehumanizing.
I don't see what harm this conversation has. People who aren't terrible will be better educated and people who are terrible weren't trans allies in the first place. What have we lost?
e:
Frankly they can call me a biological male all day if they want to deliver some hormones to a girl who needs them.
You know they're going to stop that, right? They're not going to allow people to transition at all if they get their way.
Uh huh. As if this 1% of 1% are only ones of us who have lost our hobbies in the wake of having our life saving medical care revoked. So we should all make the conversation about them.
Do you have any idea how much losing access to HRT and surgeries disrupts a persons life and hobbies? How much a sex change in general does that? There isn’t a single one of us among us who hasn’t had their life knocked off course by a sex change it’s not that special.
Sports is a losing issue that sucks up all the air in the conversation and leaves the rest of us dehumanized. Conservatives know it that’s why they chose it.
Response to your edit: THEY HAVE ALREADY STOPPED DOING THAT AND YOU STILL THINK ITS ABOUT SPORTS. That’s the entire point. Stop fighting on their terms. Every time they try to make it about sports change the subject to what matters.
Why are you making it one thing or the other? We can have more than one conversation. Do you think we should shut up about trans rights altogether because all this bickering over such an insignificant number of people is distracting from larger human rights issues?
If it's the case that the conversation itself upsets you because it hurts and you're sick of seeing it, I totally get that; it's valid.
So by your logic we should just roll over and allow them to run roughshod over our rights then while we debate every minute detail of our bodies and whether they affect competitiveness in silly games.
Got it. The general population has barely any attention capacity for this so let’s just keep playing on the conservatives terms then. Great effort.
For every conversation you have about hormone levels you could be raising awareness of far more pressing issues in our community and calling conservatives bluffs instead of falling for the red herring.
I would like to understand what you're saying better. I assume the original OP was a thread about sports (though honestly I have no idea). Given that context, how should someone in OP's position behave/respond (if at all) to the posts about trans women in sports?
And yet? I want everybody to shut up about it because we have far more pressing issues at hand. When it comes to women’s sports the public has made up their mind and the facts don’t matter.
So do I, which is why I reported those comments to be removed, but then realised that the only mod in the community agrees, and so they wouldn't only not be removed, but more of them would be encouraged, which I think is unacceptable, especially if the instance hosting them has rules against bigotry, which is what this is.
If that were true you would have replied by ignoring their red herring (women’s sports) and brought the attention back to the real issues—lack of access to medical care, criminalization of trans legal status, etc.
Instead you decided to debate them over nitpicky “biological advantage” arguments which just reinforces the myth in the minds of readers that the only thing we have to lose here are silly games for entertainment and fun. That’s exactly what they want and you fell for it.
oh fuck off you pick-me loser.
Hate to break it to you but we’re 1% of the population.
We don’t need to be picked but we absolutely do need to be tolerable in the eyes of average cishet people so they leave us alone.
So anyway, some of us have experience from more than two decades of activism & organizing seeing what actually works to secure us basic legal and medical rights.
Others live on hexbear.net and toss terms like “pick-me loser” around at any transsexual with a sense of pragmatism. Be mad about it.
I haven't debated them though? I called them transphobes, left 3 links for the sake of anyone who might be reading their nonsense and want some correct information, blocked them all, and reported the issue.
Literally nobody in the trans community cares about this topic until conservatives discovered it was effective.
🙇🏻♀️🙇🏻♀️🙇🏻♀️
I wound up revising that part out on my second read. But for anyone reading this quote yes I did that in my OG post. And it’s true I just didn’t feel it flowed with the rest of what I wrote
