ASUS is apparently killing the ability to root present and future Zenfone, Updated

ASUS is apparently killing the posibility of me being a potential customer of their smartphones.
- Rooting users are only a small percentage of all users so they probably won't even notice unfortunately.
  sent from rooted phone
  
  People who just want a vanilla experience likely all buy Samsung.
  
  Doesn't matter if I ever want to root my phone or not.
  It's mine.
- ASUS annihilated the possibility I'd ever buy any ASUS product after the way they handled the 7800X3D/AM5 VoC issue. I had never really noticed, but a pretty big swathe of my tech came from them (laptop, monitor, and motherboard among others) but no more.
  
  It's a big company. Lots of people in lots of departments doing lots of different things. Do you swear off Samsung memory or flash because of their practices around their TV's or refrigerators?
- While this sucks, realistically it's not going to even affect their bottom line. The percentage of people rooting their phones is miniscule, and even less when you look at a single vendor.
  Doesn't mean I still like the trend.

Oh, fuck off. I'm not one to root my phone, but you own the damn thing. Once it's in your hands, the maker should have no right to tell you what to do with it.
- Yeah, I'm really tired of this.
  We should be able to root and install any OS on our phones like we can do on PC.
  I don't use root or custom ROMs on my phone anymore but this is something that should always be possible.
- Consumers seem to be too dumb for their own good.
  
  Regulators seem to be too captured for consumers' good.

Well there goes any compelling reason to buy their phones lol
- I was genuinely thinking about going with an ASUS phone next because of the unlockable bootloader, this really sucks to see.
  
  There are plenty of makers doing unlockable bootloaders. Honestly, just avoid Samsung.
  
  Same here. Well they lost a potential costumer.
- Yeah no reasons besides only tiny stuff like being only flagship under 6", better speakers than samsung, better cooling and less throttling than samsung, headphone jack, near stock android. More like there are no compelling reasons to root anymore, enjoy your 1k samsung throttling tho
  
  2 years of updates means you’ll quickly end up with a phone that’s waiting to be hacked
- I remember owning their Transformer tablet back when Honeycomb first launched.

Considering their crappy major release and security update support, rooting and flashing custom images is basically a requirement.

And there I was seriously considering getting one. Greed is ruining good things again.
- I don't understand how this move is even supposed to make them more money.
  
  My guess is they're going to slow down the device on new android and block rooting so you can't install your own OS, also, probably doing a lot of spying on the users.
- Again? I didn't realize the ride had stopped for a bit. .

Locked bootloader and only 2 years of upgrades? Is not like Zenfones are cheap either. Hard pass!

This is such an anti-consumer move, by refusing to unlock the bootloader Asus hinders the ability of users to extend their devices' life beyond Asus's original support window by flashing alternative ROMs...
- I'd like to see right to repair laws expanded to right to unlock. I think you could make a reasonable argument that a working device that's not receiving security updates is just as broken as a device that's experienced a hardware failure.
  
  As much as I agree, I don't think our legislators are knowledgable enough to be able to handle the issue, and majority of the users don't care enough to push for something like this. This isn't like USB-C vs Lightning where users are sick of buying cables and chargers, so the issue is much more visible.

Simple fix: stop buying Asus phones. Once their profit drops they will let you unlock bootloader

Why do so many phone manufacturers hate letting you unlock their bootloaders? Every Google phone lets you do this, and they probably have the most secure Androids of them all.
- Google shouldn't be our shining light on phone rules lol
  
  pixels are by far the best to degoogled your phone and to have privacy/security/freedom actually
  they go above and beyond letting you unlock your bootloader
  
  See why GrapheneOS only supports pixels
- Probably because they know their OS is a duct-taped piece of garbage which could fall to pieces if you look at it wrong while unlocked.

A typical example of planned obsolescence what an effective way of killing my plans to get an Asus phone as my next daily driver assuming this is true
Some important context from the article:
A Reddit user claims that the company’s developer liaison on its Telegram channel has no knowledge of any such development. “According to them, the unlock tool server is in maintenance and will resume in Q3,” the person writes; We’ve written to ASUS to clarify the situation and will update this article when and if we hear more.
But here is the thing why do I need to use a tool to connect to a server just to be allowed to unlock the bootloader? I don't and didn't need such a thing to unlock the bootloader of my Samsung Galaxy phone (planned obsolescence ladies and gentlemen)
- But here is the thing why do I need to use a tool to connect to a server just to be allowed to unlock the bootloader
  It's been this way since I first flashed a custom ROM on my 2011 Xperia and I've never gotten it. It seems so useless. Either Huawei or Xiaomi wanted me to provide a REASON for unlocking.
  I think Nexus phones were unlockable without making a request to a server. I might be wrong though. But I do miss the Nexus line.
  
  Pixel devices don't require permission via a server. Unlocking is enabled via developer settings on the device.
  Doing it any other way is user-hostile.
- I suspect it's to keep a record which can be used to defend themselves from lawsuits. "You caught that virus after you removed our protections, so it's your own fault. Here's the receipt."
- Am on a galaxy 21 U5g and was looking at my next phone being a zenfone.
  Not a chance now.

Very easy way to remove an almost perfect phone from my list of upgrade considerations.
Edit:
Saw the tweet from Asus saying an unlock tool will be available soon.
- Exactly !!

Boo you whore. Asus really is just kicking itself in the dick the last 5 years or so.
- No kidding, especially with their recent motherboards catching on fire, and then voiding users' warranties for updating to the beta BIOS that fixes the issue, fiasco.
  They used to be such a good company; what happened?
- Yeah, don't have one of these, but I was looking at one before settling on a Pixel 7 Pro instead. Have had some sketchy interactions with Asus regarding support and warranty in the past. Might be looking elsewhere in the future where ever Asus is an option. I really don't like they changing promises retroactively.

Do consumer friendly phones exist at this point?
- Pixel phones are the few ones that you can unlock the bootloader and lock again.
- Sony allows unlocking the bootloader on a lot of their devices. Except two new US-specific models, according to their site.
- fairphone is fully repairable and rootable

... aaaand another brand I'll be avoiding when looking for a new phone. In my eyes a phone that can't be rooted is kind of like a computer without access to an administrator account - you can do stuff with it, but at one point your hands are tied.

This is exactly why I sent my Zenphone 9 back. Shame because it was such a good little phone and one of the few flagships with a headphone jack.
- Zenfone 9 can't be bootloader unlocked?
  
  Nope. At least not when I bought mine only a couple of months ago, I guess right when they blocked the unlocking tool from being used. Super annoying.

asus has killed the possibility of me being a potential customer then lol
- I still don't buy Sony over the rootkit escapade and that was nearly 30 years ago.
- I bought their Zenfone 5 in 15 and I always chose ASUS MoBos whenever I need to upgrade. Not anymore.

The end of an era. Companies also locked the bootloader back then and you'll need to find a vulnerability to exploit in order to unlock it. When custom roms starting to become popular, companies relaxed their stance and allowing their customers to unlock the bootloader using an official channel instead of utilizing a security exploits, perhaps as a competitive advantage so power users would recommend them to their friends and family.
Now with declining popularity of rooting and custom roms, companies are starting to stop allowing their customers to unlock the bootloader again. From their perspective, allowing bootloader unlocking is nothing but trouble (support-wise) and might even cannibalize sales (why upgrade your phone every two years when you can install a custom ROM with the latest version of Android), so declining popularity of custom ROMs is a perfect excuse for them to stop allowing bootloader unlocking.
- Once digital media got away with "actually we are just letting you borrow it and can take it away whenever we want", hardware manufacturers have been drooling to do the same. Apple and game console manufacturers are most of the way there already.
  
  You will own nothing and be happy.
  
  I suspect we'll eventually need to create a standard much like th PC Clone, in which hardware, OS and software are independently produced and support compatibility standards.
  Not in the current clime of unregulate capitalism, though.

It's my device. I will do with it whatever the fuck I desire

Looks like my current Zenfone running LineageOS is my last Zenfone.

Oh come on. I wanted a zenfone, I wanted the compact phone with a headphone jack and actual components. But if they're being cocky about it, there's no point. I guess I'll have to find another brand
- Tbh the headphone jack is kind of mid on the zf8 anyway. Every IEM and headphone I had had a treble spike and lower bass on it for some reason.
  
  Still better than being stuck on bluetooth crap.
  
  Agreed. I use a USBC dongle DAC now because the headphone jacks are usually underpowered.
- At least there is still kind of some alternatives, like the Xperia 5IV (and the upcoming Xperia 5V) and galaxy s23 though they have problems of their own.
  Namely poor cooling on the xperias and the tens of versions of Galaxy phones making finding a compatible custom rom and kernel pretty much impossible if you live in the wrong parts of the world

In a while ASUS won't be able to sell its phones in the EU. I guarantee it.
- I really hope the EU requires manufacturers to allow a bootloader unlock. Apple would shit themselves.

I dropped OnePlus for this reason last year, after having 5 models starting the OnePlus 1, and ending with the 8T. Apart from OxygenOS being a buggy mess, I should be able to do what I want with my phone's software
- Got any recommendations? I've been with them for 3 phones starting on 2 and I'm thinking on replacing my 6. I was already looking at other companies but not sure who would be good.
  
  oneplus 11 is going to get lineages soon
  its actually in beta rn

- I’m surprised they would make an unpopular move like this.
  Because it's only unpopular to a niche audience. Granted, those buying a Zenfone are niche, but still. They stand to make more by locking the phones down for Samsung-level bullshit than they do from the customers they'll lose here.
- Lol still the motherboard circlejerk when they fixed it in a week, if you like walled gardens just say so, u dont know any person irl rooting their phone

My biggest problem with unlocking the bootloader is that many apps look for an unlocked bootloader as "Its rooted" according to that app but unlocking the bootloader and being rooted is 2 different things. I only want to run a custom rom I dont want to root. But you end up having to do the whole thing and running Magisk to hide the root and unlocked bootloader.
- You usually need to go one step further and install Magisk so you can control what apps "see" about the phone.
- I always root my phones and I found that installing those app on a cloning environment, like island, usually has them working fine

Which means, legally, you can no longer own even the hardware of a Zenfone you bought, you now only license it. Since their OEM software is proprietary and in nearly every software's TOS they can revoke your license to it at any time for any reason, which would effectively brick the phone if bootloader unlocking is not possible.

Asus is really going down the drain...

The problem with companies trying to stop this is the fact that there will be at least one person/team who will find a way to bypass this.
No amount of corporate software devs/engineers can stop the might of a determined team on the internet from achieving their goals when it comes to this kinda stuff.
Edit:
Don't know whether the bootloader locking is actually coming or not because I saw a different post saying it was a misunderstanding.
- This is just simply not the case. There are multiple phones that have no known bootloader bypass to this day. Sk17i springs immediately to mind.
- The updated response from Asus:
  The service team reply misunderstood the situation. Unlock tool is unavailable at this moment but we are allowing the possibility to unlock, please stay tuned.
  So the server is down and will be back up. But that is not exactly the most reassuring response. It kind of seems like they are planning on removing it later or majorly altering it.

It's funny that looking around almost every single piece of ASUS hardward I bought over the years, I chose them because I could do more with their kit than I could do with the cheaper stuff and a lot of that had to do with access to the hardware (overclockeability of things like motherboards and graphics boards, much more configurable and better hardware for routers and media players and so on).
So I'm wandering what exactly is their unique value proposition on smartphones versus brands which are much more well known and well established in the regular consumer segment if they're ditching being the superior choice for the more technical users: what exactly is the point of "same shit as everybody else" hardware for premium prices?!
- Didn't even know they were great for it, but my motherboard has been a sexy beast for for iommu grouping

I feel eventually every company would do the same.
- I think it more likely we'll get to the point where getting a key to unlock the bootloader requires some kind of bullshit businesses license, or else is only possible on higher end phones. Kind of like how Windows is increasingly walling options off from everyone except Enterprise users.
  Or the end result of this eSIM shit comes to pass: unlocking the bootloader breaks the SIM and/or the carrier refuses to let it on the network.
  
  But do carriers really have a horse in this race? SIMs are separately secured so all they care about is having as many in use as possible. Whatever game of cat and mouse manufacturers choose to play with the users is their business.
  I don't think carriers will want the headache that comes with SIMs checking if they're used on so-and-so devices, especially if it involves depending on a service they don't control (like Google).

I can't believe this shit... I was planning on getting the Zenfone 10. with it's headphone jack, small size, and Android feel.

So they will just be bricks in a few years

Buy motorola edge 30
Put lineage on it
???
Profit

Some here are mixing bootloader unlocking with rooting. They're not the same thing.
Asus broke bootloader unlocking, so you can only use the original ROM in the original state. You can't install a custom ROM or flash something like Magisk to root your device.
You can unlock without rooting or without installing a custom ROM. You can install a custom ROM without rooting. You can use stock and root. And you can use a custom ROM and root. But all this is only possible if you can unlock the device's bootloader.
- Also, something I don't see people discuss enough: for security, you also need to be able to re-lock the bootloader after installing a custom ROM. Otherwise anyone can inject code into the system partition if they have physical access to your device, which would also compromise your encrypted storage. So if there's no way to reverse the bootloader unlocking, that's also bad.

Don't these phones only have 2 years of security updates? I believe samsung S23 is a better choice as a small phone as it has 5 years of security updates.

OK. Pixels forever it is.

welp, no chance I'm ever considering their phones in future

I have been thinking about getting the ZenFone 10 as well. I have seen a lot of similar posts here and on various google searches. In the XDA forum for the phone there also a topic about not being able to unlock the bootloader/root, but there is a bit more info on the reasoning.
"A moderator in the Asus ZenTalk forum posted that they are working on a new release of the unlock tool and that it should be available in Q3 2023."
https://forum.xda-developers.com/t/unlocking-the-bootloader.4607595/
- Very cool. But they removed it for now, so I'll assume it's permanent until proven otherwise. Not very cool.

I used to own a ZenFone, and Asus's technical support was awful. I guess I'm glad I don't use one now

What phone should I buy that is not complete trash and I can do what I want with? My Samsung phone is almost dying and I really don't want another Samsung, or Asus.
- Xiaomi flagships are easily rootable. If not anything else, you can install Xiaomi.eu roms
- These have got me curious: https://www.pine64.org/pinephonepro/
  
  I have a bunch.... If you're good with Linux and like to mess with your phone daily, you can probably daily drive it with minimal frustration. That is if you just want calls, SMS, and sort of MMS. Other apps or services are still rough around the edge.
  If you just want something that works and you don't have to mess with it, stay with android/IOS. I still use my pixel3 with grapheneOS. I like the Speakers too much to upgrade.
- Motorola Edge g52 is quite a nice phone for low price. They allow rooting, have a jack, supports lineageOS and so on.

One less potential customer here then

This is sad to see. Replying from Lineage OS on Asus.

Are they going to increase their abysmal security update support time?

What the lame, user already buy they product but user can't modify it like apple did....

If I ever come across anyone in the wild who actually has one I'll be sure to warn them not to root their phone.

Tbh, it has been years since I last rooted a phone. There is hardly any reason left to do it tbh.
- Plenty of reasons.
  System wide adblock
  Advanced permission management
  Backups and exports of system apps
  Full uninstall of bloatware (instead of mere hiding them with adb)
  Enabling screenshots system-wide
  And a bunch of other stuff I need in order to have a fully functioning device.
  
  Advanced permission management
  Backups and exports of system apps
  Two things previously possible in stock android (via appops & adb backups), but no longer possible to any realistic extent (particularly ADB backups, as most devs disable this for their apps). These are the main factors for me rooting personally
  
  Can't you remove bloatware with adb nowadays?
  See https://www.makeuseof.com/uninstall-android-app-adb-system-apps-bloatware/
  Also https://stackoverflow.com/questions/18755739/
- Yes there is.
  If you want a cfw, which you do because your phone either comes with 2 years of updates or has touchwiz.
  If you run cfw you NEED safetynet. Even the witzair app crashes without it. If you cfw and need safetynet, you have to have magisk. Magisk needs root for the safetynetfix.
- I have been using an old samsung tablet with lineage os (android 12), but the last stock rom was android 6.
  So yeah, for me the ability to unlock the boot loader is a must. And that's not even mentioning getting away of spooky-ware I got as a gift a Huawei phone, really good phone but when I tried to search an app using the sistem laucher it fucking asked for a lot of data, fingerprints, etc. I was sorry to this person but I just sold it ASAP since I wasn't able to install a Custom Rom to get away from all that crap.

God damnit. I was looking forward to buying a Zenfone 10 later this year, and keeping it for another five with the help of alternative OS's. If this is true, I'll need to reconsider. But there's still some hope that it isn't true, if you read the article.

Asus gave an update saying the server is currently down but will be back up. But their response was not exactly the most reassuring that bootloader unlock will continue to be available.
The service team reply misunderstood the situation. Unlock tool is unavailable at this moment but we are allowing the possibility to unlock, please stay tuned.

Fuck. The Zenfone 10 was the first phone in a while that got me excited, and now this. I was really gonna buy one.

In search of incredible no more.
- Oh I think they keep searching. They're just not always finding it.