concern trolling for voter apathy isn't radical it's boring
I won’t tell you how to vote. I just encourage you to vote. You’re not radical for ditching the only miniscule right the state has granted you to do some small aid for your neighbors.
If your vote doesn't matter so much, why are so many people telling us not to vote?
^^because ^^it ^^does ^^matter
Vote!
AMEN 💯💯💯
all this dialogue is also such a huge spit in the face to the women and POC who FOUGHT for the right to vote. yes, it’s a right with limited scope and fraught with corruption. but to discount it altogether on the public stage is so fucking disingenuous.
"Voting doesn't change anything, it's pointless and things won't get better"
Woman's suffragists, civil rights protestors, and gay rights protestors: "Are we a fucking joke to you?"
I’ve seen elections tied that had to go to a coin toss. This flipped the government of a nearby town. Every vote matters.
The shoe that was thrown at Bush matters more than all the voting youre gonna do in your life. Dont fool yourself
Okay, buddy.
I'm sure you are more politically relevant than we are.
It certainly mattered to Canadian politics. One of our politicians participated in a shoe throwing event at -24 in Montreal where ppl threw their shoes at a picture of Bush to protest US involvement in that incident and Harper 's willingness to engage Canada in a meaningless war. One of the protesters was a provincial left-leaning party co-leader and MNA (Amir Khadir).
However, voting matters more than one successful protest on one issue. You would need to throw thousands of shoes to get shit done if that's how you want to go about it.
I'll have a voting against trump is important with a side of fuck you genocide joe.
That's good as long as it's acknowledged what the only viable method of voting against Trump is.
fuck joe biden. but at the same time, fuck dolan more. I'd rather have 4 more years of relative calm with a shithead that nobody likes than to be subjected to another 4 years (at a minimum) of the crazy shit which is a trump presidency.
Okay, but holding your nose and voting without a meaningful push to do away with First Past The Post voting after the election is like wrapping a severed limb with a tourniquet and then cleaning your hands and calling it a day.
Yes the patient didn't die, but rot is setting in the mortal wound as we speak.
So, let's start the process now so we are free to vote for who best represents us in the future.
based
I'll take the lesser of the two evils and I will vote Blue, but I wish the Dems would have found a younger candidate. At least the Democrats are not crying about suspending the US Constitution. If you vote for Putin's Sock Puppet, you're voting for a dictator.
Beyond regularly voting in solidarity. We need to start running these younger better candidates ourselves. Republicans run unopposed in many places on state ballots. And Democrats have spent roughly the last decade ignoring these positions. We might not win all or even a large chunk of them. But we could by accident when a few and start building new coalitions from there. Making inroads into places that had given up on getting better. Voting is only the first step.
And Democrats have spent roughly the last decade ignoring these positions.
Michelle Vallejo is 32. Democrats cut her funding in her election against Monica De La Cruz in the crucial last month, during an election cycle in which the party did ad buys for MAGA candidates.
Younger, better candidates run. Party leadership prefers a maga chud to a progressive in any given position.
Vallejo is running again. I hope she has alternate funding this time.
I’ll take the lesser of the two evils and I will vote Blue, but I wish the Dems would have found a younger candidate.
I'll vote for the lesser of two evils and don't care one bit about his age. But I consider his support for genocide to be morally repugnant, and bitterly resent being manipulated into a position where my vote renders me monstrous.
I wish the Dems would have found a younger candidate
monkey's paw curls
Meet 2028 presidential nominee Eric Adams
And voting for Biden is a vote for Genocide
Wrong, the GOP would given Israel a blank check too.
I think you are in the meme
Every option you have is a vote for Genocide. Encouraging genocide is a bipartisan act. Ignore every bipartisan issues to select who you will vote for, otherwise you won't be allowed to complain about the results for 4 whole years.
You wouldn't want to not have an excuse to complain, would you?
Voting for Trump is also a vote for Genocide (capital 'G' for some reason).
Voting for a third party is similar to not voting.
So, are helping trump win, or are you not helping trump lose?
According to Amnesty International, Human Rights Watch, and the UN, the Obama administration absolutely committed war crimes. Voting matters, and no matter what you think of Biden he is infinitely better than Trump, but don't roll your eyes and pretend that the people complaining about extrajudicial murder-robots are crazy. Credible institutions believe Obama violated international law with his drone program, you don't get to pretend that's fake because you don't like it.
fully agree! but your qualms about eye rolling absolutely do not apply to me, perhaps you misread some of my tone? :) see some of the body text where i note that he has blood on his hands.
my use of the “but genocide joe” phrase was a (perhaps lackluster) dig against concern-trolling; the disturbing mincing of absolutely valid criticism of Biden into a “skip-the-vote cuz it doesn’t matter” platform that is essentially thinly veiled maga propaganda.
i do see your concern with how i phrased this, as again im totally with you in condemning Genocide Joe. if you have ideas of how to better phrase this meme i’m totally down to modify the text of it. :)
PS i fully believe that obama committed war crimes. the title of this post was not ironic, i believe that statement genuinely. bro committed attrocities that are not fake. again, not sure if you were misreading the tone there.
Yes voting matters!! Biden and Trump aren't the only ones running!
One person is a politician, and one is a rapist con artist. I'll take the politician please.
"Voting doesn't change anything" is a thinktank tactic of saying "Don't vote unless you're gonna vote who I discreetly like"
In Quebec, we have a saying that I would like to share with you. It comes from our love for complaining. We are completely addicted to complaining about everything. It's our third national sport after Hockey and curling.
"If you don't vote, you can't complain"
If you vote for a person and they don't do the promised thing, you can complain. You have an excuse reason.
If you vote for a person and someone else gets elected, you can complain that the person you voted for would have done a better job.
If you do NOT vote, you didn't do shit. You didn't do the strict minimum. You have no excuse to complain about any of it, because you did not participate in the decision.
but what if i want to have my cake and eat it too! i want to avoid doing the strict minimum and complain i feel like you are ignoring my emotional needs in all of this /s :)
It is rather convenient that 2024 is the year everyone is choosing to be upset about dead Palestinians, but double tap drone strikes are definitely a war crime.
https://www.icc-cpi.int/sites/default/files/Publications/Rome-Statute.pdf
i mean the title genuinely. obama did war crimes. that is a true unironic statement.
let me see about editing the title it seems to be causing confusion.
edit: okay fixed. i do want to push back on your statement tho. everyone is NOT suddenly getting mad about dead palestinians. people have been pissed about the apartheid regime in israel for decades. be careful with your assertions here.
I'm happy to accept that there's people who have been concerned for a long time about Israel. I've seen protests about 15 years ago in my own city in the UK, for about an afternoon. Never saw it again. Never saw any protests about any other genocides happening around the world, like Darfur, only this one.
But what's new is linking it to a sitting US president, in an election year. Israel's genocide has been supported by everyone since Truman recognised it a day after it was set up. The USA is a genocidal country literally built on genocide.
It is rather convenient that 2024 is the year everyone is choosing to be upset about dead Palestinians
Talk about your daring takes.
It is rather convenient that 2024 is the year everyone is choosing to be upset about dead Palestinians,
Not everyone. You obviously aren't.
who's saying voting doesnt change anything?
The fish in the meme
A bunch of assholes, not limited to Lemmy. You'll see them pop up soon.
enough to be scary for someone who doesn’t like seeing human rights stripped
People living in a very biased state.
Yeah, voting in the right person will solve deindustrialization, homelessness, decadent academia, drugs, inflation etc etc
votes 3rd party
and now we let the copium roll in
Can we try out Ranked Choice voting (or something similar) first? We don't have to pass federal reform, it can be passed on a per state basis. In fact, there is little stopping democrats from passing it in states they control.
Whats the hold up blue states?
People who say that usually don't vote.
I vote, even though I know it changes nothing.
I won’t tell you how to vote. I just encourage you to vote.
I genuinely hate this shit, because its so nakedly dishonest.
We played the game back in 2000 with Ralph Nader and "I don't care who you vote for, so long as you vote" collapsed into "Ralph Nader helped George Bush Jr steal the election" minutes after the polls closed in Florida. Then we played it again in 2016, when Jill Stein was accused of being a Putin shill. The Republicans played it in 1992 when (not entirely unfairly, Perot reviled Bush Sr for taking a foreign policy position of reconciliation towards Vietnam) Ross was blamed for George's abysmal poll numbers following Desert Storm.
Anyone who says this, while expressing any serious degree of interest in the outcome of the election, is simply lying.
this post is specifically me confronting the position that elections are useless and should be avoided.
check through my comments in this post and you will find no instance of me telling someone who to vote for.
and yet you are the one coming into my comment section and calling me a liar. kindly stop it with the attacks, this is asshole behavior you are exhibiting.
Not voting is a valid choice in an election though. In part the US has Trump as a political figure because the Tea Party movement wasn't afraid to tank the 2012 midterms and hand Obama's administration the legislature. If your representatives have to choose between loosing and meeting your demands, eventually they get the message and meet your demands.
Sounds like you're suffering a serious case of "First Past The Post voting".
I'm surprised you've let this condition go untreated for so long.
Vote, or don't.
The important thing is that electoralism won't solve our problems and is a waste of time for the working class.
Edit: Downvote me all you like. But I'd be interested if any of you have a plan of voting capitalism away. I'm all ears.
huge news you’ll be happy to hear: you can do both voting and direct action. those aren’t somehow mutually exclusive. i do both. 👍 hope this helps
Never claimed otherwise. I critizised the whole practice of trusting in electoralism.
All that discourse surrounding electoralism distracts from proper political action. How many people vote every soandso years and think that this was the vital act of a democratic society?
3rd parties can be made viable by passing electoral reform at the state level.
We aren't Russia (yet), we can still change things if we change how we vote! Look up a video on First Past the Post voting for more information on how and why the spoiler effect exists.
I live in Europe, so I know about other votino systems (and I know the game theory behind fptp voting, thanks).
Even in Europe, where you have a more broad spectrum of parties in parliament, you can't vote away capitalism.