Questions
Questions
Questions
Snowflakes in these comments hurt when someone’s lived experience is pointed out when it’s not even saying they’re the ones being racist. Same people who get upset at fast food workers getting higher wages as if that has any direct impact on them (other than the whole getting our economy and society into a better place).
First question in the interview I had a few years ago: "Do you have a green card?"
I was born here asshole. I'm brown skinned.
Exactly, and for any white people in the comments about to say "well they have to ask everyone to know you can legally work,I get asked about my citizenship status too in the job interviews, it's just a box HR has to tick"
Yes, it is just a box HR has to tick, which is why they will usually ask after a few other questions, and in my pasty pale experience, they ask me "and just confirming you're legally eligible to work in [country], are you a citizen... Or a PR" and the trail off, they don't ask about working visas or our equivalent of green cards, they assume I'm going to say "yes, citizen" and move on.
Meanwhile my partner, who is also white, but from his accent he is clearly not "from here" will also get similar treatment, they wait until a few questions into the interview, they ask about his legal work eligibility, they will mention working visas in the question, but it's still coming from a place of genuine information gathering.
My brown cousins on the other hand? "do you have a work visa?" is one of the first questions they get asked. Not even "do you have the legal right to work here? Like a Work visa or citizenship", just straight up "do you have a work visa?" because the assumption is that they are not a citizen or PR because of their skin colour.
Lol I've seen this first hand so many times. "When did you come to Canada? Is this your first winter? Have you seen snow before? Was it hard learning English?" Like, do you think Canada just recently opened its borders and everyone who isn't white must be new?
I’m not brown but I was once mistaken for Mexican immigrant. The way the person treated me in that instance was really eye opening to me for how folks can get treated that I never otherwise would’ve have experienced.
These are all wildly inappropriate questions to ask a random stranger without some prior explicit context between the people.
Are you surprised when a good meaning person asks when a slightly chubby woman is due, when she isn’t actually pregnant?
Actually, yes, because that's been widely known as a risky question to ask for so long it would surprise me. Then I would question them actually being a well-meaning person.
Not surprised, but I'm also not convinced it's well-meaning so much as ignorance to the effect of their own actions. Otherwise, I think were mostly on the same page. It generally should be considered uncool to ask someone a personal questions without a valid reason to do so, regardless of age, genital status, or arbitrarily assigned category loosely based upon skin or the overall attitude of one religious group towards another.
For all the people missing the point of this comic particularly in the U.S.: Look at who has held political and financial power for the last two hundred years, including this one. There are lots of pictures and paintings of people. Do you notice anything in common between nearly all of them besides having wealth and power? Think about the position of everyone else not fitting that description and tell us all again why you personally feel attacked and why this comic is not relevant.
Ok, all that aside, that third chick asking about college--- what does that shirt mean...? No clothes hangers? Is that an abortion statement or does she just like folded clothes over hung ones?
Definitely a pro-choice statement: "Don't make women resort to [risky abortion techniques]"
I assumed it was an abortion statement (pro-choice, as in, "don't make women resort to unsafe back alley clotheshanger abortions").
i think it could be a reference to saying no to plastic clothes hangers, since clothes hangers are an enormous source of plastic waste.
Edit: yes i understand the anti dangerous abortion symbolism, but here are some sources to explain the environmental impacts that are starting to gain some press.
https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/plastic-hanger-fun-fact-20-billion-landfills-every-year-gary-barker
I like that take, and I'm going to go charish my lovely ceder hangers for more than just their rustic smell.
I think a funnier version of this was Ms. Morello from everybody hates chris lol
So comical.
It's almost like time progresses
I think you're missing the point of the comic. Time is progressing for both women, and the people talking to them in the comments have questions based on where that woman is in her life and development.
While both women are in the same stage of life, the questions being asked are not the same questions.
The people asking que to the the woman of colour are brining a bucket load of presumptions to the conversation.
The comic is pointing out how racial prejudice or even innocent assumptions are forms of microagressions, as the questions asked to the white woman are mostly purely information gathering, where as the questions towards the black woman first require her to correct a misconception before she can even answer the question.
ITT: Virtue signalling.
Oh, the irony.
Isn't pointing that out your own attempt at virtue signalling... ie you're so much better because you're above it all?
I have a better hypothesis; the comic its self is about the virtue, morality, and ethics of different social behaviours....
....so if that's the topic in the comic, then THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT EVERY SHOULD BE TALKING ABOUT!
Like, do you expect people to not be discussing the comic in the comments? What else did you expect? See how your little holier than thou comment doesn't actually make sense in the light of this.
At some point you have to think for yourself about what you see, rather than regurgitating familiar political slogans as if that's actual thought.
It's funny how the people writing comics like these don't see that they are perpetuating a stereotype themselves.
Racist sterotypes are worse than sterotypes about racists.
pOiNTInG oUt rAciSm iS ThE sAmE aS bEInG RaciSt
I think I get what you’re saying. If we don’t talk about things, it ceases to be part of our culture. Reminds me of something Morgan Freeman said:
"Stop talking about it. I'm going to stop calling you a white man," Freeman says to Wallace. "And I'm going to ask you to stop calling me a black man. I know you as Mike Wallace. You know me as Morgan Freeman. You wouldn't say, 'Well, I know this white guy named Mike Wallace.' You know what I'm sayin'?"
I don’t know if it’s practical in a world culture of billions of people, but I understand the thought process.
That view feels overly romanticised to me, tbh; the idea that the way to stop racism is to just not acknowledge it. That not drawing attention to things will just make it go away.
There's a lot of institutionalised racism in many countries, either due to racism itself or as a knock on effect from other failed systems.
And, of course, there's just plain bigotry that is passed patent to child and from social group to social group. That's not going to stop by just censoring media.
The message of this comic is, basically, "here's some unconscious biases you could be making". Reading it as "this is how you're supposed to talk to black people" is... Well, if that's the reading you make, then whether the comic exists or not isn't going to change anything.
It feels like this sort of thing makes people feel uncomfortable and they try to justify the removal of the media rather than grappling with the concept of privilege (which, tbf, is hard for people to do).
That's unrelated to this comic though, Morgan Freeman is correct that people shouldn't arbitrarily bring someones race into a conversation.
But this comic isn't doing that this comic is pointing out racism, and racism should always be pointed out and labelled as such when it is seen, because as a society we need to browbeat the shit out of people who are consistently racist and you can't do that unless you go and say "that's racist"
You got it. Racism is treating people differently based on race.
The only way to end it is to stop drawing on differences.
You got it.
We can't beat racism by continually pointing out racial differences. This is just more racism and isn't helpful.
Now I’m worried that I’m blind to that stereotype, too. Care to elaborate?
Now IM NOT SAYING I AGREE OR THAT THIS BIAS DOESNT EXIST but I think that what they are getting at is that pointing out the stereotyping you do perpetuate it to a degree. Sort of a flip side to how sometimes people just assume that every black person has experienced overt aggressive racism or every gay person has had a huge coming out moment where they had to "break it" to their parents.
Like if I was jewish and I made a joke about how cheap I am and someone at work didnt get the joke because they had never heard the "covetous jew" stereotype. So then I'd have to explain it to them and put that knowledge into their head.
White people are all racist would be one stereotype shown here but there's a few
Waaah, "not all white people," waaah!
Hit a nerve, did they?
The very existence of this comic points to a sad reality. Is it exaggerated? Probably. But it's a damn cartoon, it's supposed to be.
Sadly, statistics sort of tend to back up at least a few of those claims, even if it is a silly cartoon. Even if people do not like to admit it. Example, in 2018, 69% of black mothers are single mothers. But people never want to speak about reality because they have been told that speaking about reality is somehow racist, which is not. No problem ever gets fixed if people refuse to look at it, honestly.
"In 2011, 72% of black babies were born to unmarried mothers,[5][6] while the 2018 National Vital Statistics Report provides a figure of 69.4 percent for this condition." The stats have not gotten better since then.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/African-American_family_structure
Around half of the US population has hypertension.
I'm guessing you wouldn't want your doctor just assuming you have it and start treating it though.
The reason why stereotypes are bad is because even if there's aggregate data trends on a broad population basis, that doesn't necessarily translate to individualized specifics.
Statistically, black math scores are worse than white.
In my high school, I was in Calculus BC in my senior year, along with most of the other smartest kids in my grade.
One of the few black students at my prep school had been in that class in his junior year and for his senior year just sat one on one with the math teacher because he was a full year ahead of us. He was also the student that I used to get the most competitive with playing chess in the student lounge (because he was legit better than me and the few victories I'd eek out were actual accomplishments), and was the one of my friends to go off to Stanford.
It'd be a real shame if someone looking at him decided that based on broad statistics relating to the melanin in his skin that he wasn't as good at math as someone with less melanin.
And personally, I'd think anyone making that leap of logic was a goddamn moron.
(Also, pro tip - it's worth thinking about the differences between averages and distributions around those averages if you are going to make an argument for there being merit in extrapolating from statistics. For example, you are more likely to be told by a mother with a child that the father is not in the picture by a white mother than a black mother if you ask the question of every mother you see.)
I'm not sure but I don't think the point is statistics. I think the point is to treat everyone equally despite the colour of their skin until you know them personally, and their situation.
Your quote doesn't support your claim. 69% of black mothers being unmarried does not mean they're single mothers. It definitely correlates, but one doesn't mean the other.
Unmarried and single are different things.
This sounds like one of those crime rate arguments for justifying racism without looking at any of the other factors.
Your choice of wording is odd, like "problem", and "better." I am 30 years old. I have been with my partner for 15 years, and we have an 8 and a 6 year old child together. We live together in our 4 bedroom home. Yes, we are black. No, there is no struggle associated with us being unmarried.
Statistics show that white people are more likely to develop skin cancer than other racial groups. Would that problem be fixed by asking every white person you meet who has mole on their face if they have skin cancer?
It is racist/sexist/discriminatory to make assumptions on individuals based on statistics.
The statistics can still be true and can be used to counter discrimination against specific groups.
To expand a little I feel it's more that people do not understand racism appropriately rather than not wanting to speak about reality. People, ironically, fear being labeled. For most racism is blatant and obvious. A "do not say or do these specific things" mentality. This leads to the misunderstanding. The reality (as you say) is we should acknowledge racism. By acting like it isn't there we are doing a disservice to the people who are affected by the systemic issues that do exist.
In the U.S. this is very much a larger cultural issue, while also being a problem elsewhere in the world. If I had to guess: Cultures with stronger authoritarian leanings in significant sub-cultures such as work and familial structures also see stronger racism or similar beliefs on the same tree. How is this fought? Humility and acknowledgement.
Agreed. But I wonder if this is butting up against a limitation of the human brain. Every person across the globe experiences stereotypes. It seems to be a natural way the human brain forms initial judgements. Hell, I don't think the comic artist realized they were making a stereotype when they made all the questions askers white.
Being aware of it helps but the best fix is to have a significant amount of personal time with the group in question. This is why it's so frustrating for someone of a particular race to hear questions like this, because they have plenty of first hand experience with members of their race. Themselves, their family, etc..
But realistically a person can't spend significant amounts of time with members of every discreet group of people they might see on a daily basis.
It's not that exaggerated if you live in central Europe.