I will rue the day this inevitably happens.
I will rue the day this inevitably happens.
I will rue the day this inevitably happens.
I'm actually pretty worried about him dying. Hopefully he has a chosen successor that he's indoctrinated.
I would rather hope that he legalizes and codifies the "flat" management structure, disallowing any one figure head from taking over and fucking things up.
Valve annoys people because it can be slow to choose to do something, because everyone works on what they want to work on, but it means average workers have a lot more agency in how they're involved in the company.
I'm sure there's till unofficial cliques and leaders, but having it in legalese for the employees post-Gabe would be nice.
I would argue the flat management makes it hard for Valve to produce things and they should re-evaluate it, but you can do this while also not turning into a rank and yank shit out fortnite clones 420 69 flossing scheme to fuck over users and line their pockets.
The problem with that is that they're a private company so that can just be undone by the largest share holder, unless that codification also splits up his equity across the employees.
Tbf as long as it doesn't go public it will probably be fine regardless of who takes the job. It doesn't take a genius to keep up the good work in a company that can afford to plan long time.
I guess you've never had a "new boss" come in, huh? Even in a private company?
Man, new bosses love to shake things up, to "make the workplace theirs." It's literally one of the most common things to happen when new bosses come, and very often it results in a deep change in company interpersonal politics.
Barry used to be your go-to guy, but the new boss has decided they just don't like Barry. Why? They couldn't tell you, but Barry gets under their skin, so it doesn't matter how he's the best guy on the team who can handle whatever is thrown at him, his role is going to be dilluted and minimized and he's going to be pushed and prodded by negative management to try to get him to just quit. Eventually, Barry will just quit because who wants to work under those conditions. Barry found a better job, and now he's replaced by your new bosses 20-something nephew who doesn't know what the fuck he is doing at all and everyone can't stand. He's a fucking loser who keeps getting promoted by the new boss.
I've been through that too many times to pretend it's just "that easy." No, generally the kind of people drawn to that role are controlling dickheads who have their own dickhead "vision" of being the biggest dickhead to ever dickhead.
You are right in that Steam would probably continue on just fine on autopilot. You might not be right by assuming that the sort of person who would seek to and achieve such a position wouldn't let their own ego dictate every decision--change for change's sake so that they can point at how wonderful they are at the job.
Yesterday I bought something on Steam for the first time in many years. (I have a large Steam library, but in recent years I've been getting games from gog and itch instead.)
Since I hadn't bought from Steam in a long time I figured I should read the "Steam Subscriber agreement" that you have to click to accept when you buy something. Let me just say now, the agreement is a very very bad deal for customers.
It goes to great lengths to make it very clear that you don't own anything. You aren't buying anything, you have no essentially rights. You are simply paying for a license subscription to use software with various conditions. Valve is able to end your subscription with no refund if you break the agreement. And the best bit:
Furthermore, Valve may amend this Agreement (including any Subscription Terms or Rules of Use) unilaterally at any time in its sole discretion.
So by using Steam we're putting a lot of trust in Valve; because the 'agreement' basically says they can do whatever they want, any time they want, for any reason they want.
Steam is quite good. I particularly appreciate their Linux support. But they are clearly using their position of dominance to make people agree to unfavourable terms. At the moment, things are fine. But make no mistake - when you use Steam, Valve has all the power. They can screw people over whenever they choose to.
With all that in mind, buying DRM free is better if you want to still have access to the software when a company decides to change direction for whatever reason.
Apparently you like to read. Open the EULA for basically any commercial software (not FOSS or open source, costs money, isn't made by some small company, basically the same criteria as >90% of the games on Steam) and you are going to learn 2 things very quickly. First, all of them are just a license to use, and second, if there are patches or an online component you will have at least as many caveats and restrictions as what is included in the Steam TOS.
Now, I'm not saying you're wrong or that I'm okay with this situation (I look for open source, free, then paid for all the software that lets me do whatever it is I'm trying to do), but the situation with Steam is very typical.
Terms like that matters more for some services than for others. For something like Spotify or Netflix, if they terminate the agreement it doesn't matter much. You lose access, but there was no accumulated value. So you can just go somewhere with only minor inconvenience. Whereas on Steam, if they terminate the agreement then you could lose decades worth of accumulated games from your library - which could be very valuable. So that's a big difference.
Now, it's unlikely that Steam will just press delete on everyone's account. But we can imagine a very profit-hungry leader taking over Steam and deciding to put the squeeze on their vast user-base. There are many things they could do; such as adding ads, requiring 'consent' to include spyware on your computer, or charging additional fees. Long term users would not be in a position to refuse these things, because their Steam library is being held as collateral.
If you trust that Steam is never going to give you up, and never going to let you down, etc. Then there is no problem. Things are currently going fine, and they may continue to be fine for a very long time. It's just a matter of trust, and power, and hedging.
Doesn't matter, Steam offers DRM free games. Steam DRM is opt-in and can be broken by anyone in seconds, and games with other DRM have a big glowing warning on their store page. You give money to Steam for their servers that support multiplayer, their workshop, seamless patching, user forums, image hosting, controller support, Proton for Linux, SteamDB, easy multiplayer via the friends interface, achievement tracking, and a large majority cut to the developers. Your complaints apply to basically every storefront, the only way you'll own data is by having it on your own disk which Steam lets you do.
Not saying that I disagree, but it has basically always been written like that...
Yeah, but that's not a reason that something is bad. As pointed out. Buying DRM free is the only possibility to really own the games you purchased.
Welcome to the modern world. Pretty much lines up with 99% of services people use daily.
I won't ever move from steam to GoG, valve makes everything too convenient.
You can use them both of course. That's what I do, and I usually just go with the one with the best price or best deal.
If it's a game that I really need to be DRM free, then GoG is best.
There's anothee way to keep having access to software no matter what companies do.
I have the generic steam crack well saved in my computer in case the decide to pull the plug.
Very good idea, I gotta look into that
How you do it?
Steam effectively makes buying games itself count as MTX. They're making your Steam library no different from your MMO inventory.
That said, I'm addicted.
To be fair, if you would own it, they would have a very different legal framework to be working in. Would they be legally allowed to shut down their servers? Or would they have to run the company until bankruptcy, so maybe decades after steam stopped being profitable? Their product is a service based on. They want the service to be able to be ended. If you buy the games like you do on steam and you own them, can they end it?
It goes to great lengths to make it very clear that you don't own anything. You aren't buying anything, you have no essentially rights. You are simply paying for a license subscription to use software with various conditions. Valve is able to end your subscription with no refund if you break the agreement.
True, but:
but in recent years I've been getting games from gog
GOG shills always claim their platform is better because muh DRM-free games and actual ownership but GOG's User Agreement states:
We give you and other GOG users the personal right (known legally as a 'licence') to use GOG services and to download, access and/or stream (depending on the content) and use GOG content. This licence is for your personal use. We can stop or suspend this licence in some situations, which are explained later on.
It's to keep people from doing stuff like requiring refunds or court cases for being banned, VAC or otherwise. To make some things not technically gambling, etc.
Valve is the paragon of gamers. They offer a great portal, free no bs family shares, pressure companies into sales on legacy software. Push VR from meme status (the oculus is even originally stolen valve tech look it up). Steam stream, steam controller, steam deck emulation of Nintendo switch, Jesus it's endless.
And still there are people like you out here who have to lead with complaints about a bunch of text which everyone knows is exclusively for legal piss matches against companies and troublemakers.
I don't know how you can be pleased by anything. Isn't your life tiring living the life of a zealot? Or do you have just an unsatisfiable need to complain?
The company may be nice now and it's okay to be happy with them, but that doesn't mean you attack the personality of someone for pointing out factual information written in your beloved companies agreements.
I don’t know how you can be pleased by anything. Isn’t your life tiring living the life of a zealot? Or do you have just an unsatisfiable need to complain?
wtf man. Did someone shit in your breakfast cereal or something?
Again, just because Valve hasn't screwed us over yet is no excuse for assuming they never will.
People probably felt the same way Unity's relatively fair licensing terms, or D&D's license. They've rolled back now, but it's common for companies to push this sort of thing, roll back, and then slowly introduce the same thing.
The point is not to avoid Steam, but to keep an eye out for scummy moves because no entity operating for profit is immune to temptation. Be ready to abandon ship should the time come or you'll be the one left holding the bag.
I hope he has some sort of contingency plan. Perhaps he can find a successor.
It involves golden tickets and the unsolved disappearances of a handful of children.
Brutal, I know, but it's the only way.
I selfishly wish he had a son or daughter to carry on his legacy lol
More generations deserve to know how good Valve is.
Chat GPT predicts one of the kids will...
...get physically pulled into valves code? Not sure how that happens lol
🎵 One clicked on files they shouldn't dare Now lost in code, they've disappeared in air Gaben warned, but they didn't heed Now in the depths of Steam, they'll forever plead
🎵 Oompa loompa doompety dah If you're not careful, you'll go too far Respect the rules when visiting Gaben's lair Or vanish forever, lost in Valve's software!
Yeah but whales are gonna get all the tickets. There's no IRL Charlie luck magic.
It really is.
You know the Hedge Fund Fuckies are just fucking salivating at the thought of Valve being available to buy.
To implement NFT Microtransaction RNG lootboxes into their games while letting them rott?
CS2 already exists. You just need to add the Pay 2 Win to the crates.
Oh shid and cume. Isn't that sorta what the free loot cards are? The ones you get randomly for doing stuff in games. Iirc you can sell them on their marketplace for money. It isn't unreasonable for a new dick head CEO to just overhaul that system into a more active gacha system for all their games.
Oh, not just their games
They’ll ruin it just like they ruin everything in pursuit of profit.
I couldn't imagine any decent reason valve would get people in charge that would want to go public with it. They have all the capital in house to fund any idiotic thing they may want to try. No reason to risk sharing profits with outside investors.
If a game is on GOG, I'd rather buy it there than on steam. Steam is great and they do a lot of great stuff, but you don't own the game if you buy it through steam.
I'm very anti-DRM as well, but I'm willing to give Valve my money even if there's a chance I lose my game down the line. Some of that money's going towards Proton and making Linux more popular
Yeah. I now buy and play almost exclusively on Linux.
I do the same. Just because the platform is great does not mean it will be in the future.
I will cause a resonance cascade on Valve HQ if that ever happens.
That, sadly, is the future. Valve is one of those rare companies that put out something interesting then got out of the way so that others could put out their ideas. Steam and PAX are a fantastic way to enable the creativity of others. I will keep my fingers crossed that this all works out, but I am fully prepared to be sad between now and, say, 10 years in the future.
I buy my favorite games from GOG when they're there so that I can keep the install files forever.
If Steam turns to shit I'll just pirate all my games again. I've already paid for them anyway.
Maybe we'll get lucky and Gaben will leave ownership of the company collectively to it's employees.
That would be the best outcome, legal framework for the "flat" management structure, making it an employee owned company.
Valve becoming a coop is the only way I could envision them avoiding a worst case corporate scenario.
Honestly, why ruin something already raking in money hand over fist? Valve is profitable, sustainable, and all around well executed.
Messing with it would cut profits!
The same reason countless studios have destroyed successful IPs (like EA). Sure it’s profitable but it could be MORE profitable. Sales were up last year? Cool story, have sales improved over that this year though??
It's not just shareholders, I mean that's a huge part why public corporations endlessly seek growth. But, even private corporations are beholden to capitalism's inherent growth imperative.
The only way to maintain solvency is to grow. Without growth you can't save, and if you can't save, you can't accumulate investment capital. Which basically means your corporation is stuck in stagnation and is being eaten alive by interest rates.
Because MBA- and CEO-brains say that raking in money hand over fist doesn't matter unless you can rake in consistently more and more money hand over fist. What normal people see as stable profits, they see as underperforming versus the bigger profits they see only in their head.
But if we add a subscription required to access already bought game we would surely make more money this quarter. Or how about charging for online play.
Greed and incompetence
In the end, the people who make these sorts of decisions will often bail out with their quarterly bonuses before the poo hits the fan. It's everyone else who has to deal with the fallout.
Because enshitifying their service would earn them short term profits, which is the only thing corps/shareholders care about.
You clearly haven't heard of private equity
If you've read/watched ready player one, that's what likely to happen if the sixers won.
GabeN is the Ruth Bader Ginnsberg of gaming. Please sir, take care of yourself, for all of us.
"Please sir, step down while there's still a chance to replace you with someone reasonable"?
So he's going to stay in his position way past when he reasonably should because of pride and not take advice from his friends and family to step down so he could transfer power to a worthy successor?
Let's not place all the blame on her Republicans were going to let Obama place anyone on the supreme Court. They rejected all his nominations. It was wait for Democrats to have full control or hang on cause Republicans wouldn't let anyone but a Republican get nominated.
She was damned if she did damned if she didn't. But cause see hanged on we all blamed her instead of rightful raging at McConnell
It needs some legally bulletproof foundation structure to own the company and continue with his values. Not easy but possible.
Steve Jobs managed to do this picking Tim Cooke. Hopefully will be the same for valve
Hey now. A divorce could also sink things. He doesn't have to die for things to go to shit.
(I know nothing of his personal life.)
Well his name didn't show up in Epstein's public records (unlike a certain CEO from a company Microsoft bought/CEO that founded/ran Microsoft) so we're fine there.
And I did look. Extensively.
It's a good sign because 1) He's smart enough to not have a paper trail and/or 2) His hobbies are innocuous, like, I think he really only cares about submersibles and knives and he wasn't stabbing people on some carbon fiber tube near the titanic so he's not a dumbass either.
You know, I am glad you thought to check.
🏴☠️
Do you know what the word shill means?
Baby, it means whatever you want it to mean.
That would require self awareness.
@Custoslibera
I think Robin Walker would be a fantastic successor.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/RobinWalker(gamedesigner)
Interesting, have not heard of them before but could be a contender.
Valve is a company whose profit model is based on DRM. They were never your friend. Thanks for proton, though.
I hope they keep with Linux...
I wish I could work for them with some sort of employee stock program. I'd be dumping literally every cent into the stock.
Cmon, you know he's going to pick a sucessor wisely
Noo, no rape please 😭
You know, when I worked in retail, the store would obviously buy up stock from suppliers for a price and then sell it for profit. I don't know all the technical terms in English, but in order for the stores to actually make money at the end of the day we had a goal of reaching that exact amount of profit, 30% of the retail price. So how exactly is this different from retail stores? Sure, they don't have to actually buy up stock, but the game companies don't have to make physical copies either. It's not like the game companies would make 100% of the money if they sold them elsewhere.
they would get really close to 100% as selling themselves would only have the cost of running a website. But on the other hand steam makes it easy for people to actually discover indie games so if an indie studio sold their game only on their own website will lose on a lot of potential customers.
Retail stores are bad
Who cares lol, that argument is so fucking weak.
Amazon has an audiobook monopoly and takes 87% cut of audible sales unless the author agrees to exclusively sell through audible. If you agree to exclusively sell through audible, Amazon only takes 79% cut of the sale. Officially they claim to take 75% and 60% cuts (for non-exclusive and exclusive), but they actually pay out considerably less than they promise.
That's what a monopoly abusing it's power to steal from creators looks like. Valve's 30% is literally market standard, and is so much lower than they could get away with.
Sources on how much audible takes per sale: My source, Original source
A private equity firm with the monopoly that Steam currently has would slowly raise that percentage as much as they could
I have listened to a ton of game developer talks over the years. Some of the old indie devs that have given talks basically all welcomed steam because it meant that they didn't have to deal with all of the stuff that steam does themselves. Before people started buying games through steam, doing an acceptable level of DRM, distribution, payments, refunds, etc. was all hand-rolled, for each company.
You can still do that yourself. Why do people stick with steam with the supposedly onerous 30% cut? It's because steam provides a valuable service. Now the people that build games don't have to deal as much with the things that aren't building games.
In my opinion, a platform like Steam was bound to emerge at some point. Let's thank our fucking stars that the company that "won" is not beholden to any shareholder and is run by a gamer that understands what people who love video games needed.
If you think that the 30% cut is too high, there's nothing stopping you from building all the infrastructure yourself. And there are plenty of companies that have done so, like Epic and, until recently, Sony.
But I would say unless you are a team building AAA games and making millions and millions a year, where the savings you can realize outweigh the cost of rolling your own infrastructure, steam is kind of a good deal.
this is a very multi faceted issue. me for example would be happy if devs got a bigger cut, but god damn if valve keeps pumping out good and sustainable devices and systems like steam deck, I'll continue to buy everything from them. I'm mad at companies who reinforce microsofts trash OS and everyone who builds unrepairable/unrepurposable laptops and consoles.
Which is totally fair in the case of steam. They actually provide a valuable service in comparison to the app stores, both to users and publishers. You are free from publishing outside of steam.
Lemmy: Corporations are terrible. None of them have your back. They're all just out to make money and the only reason they pay their employees is because slavery is illegal.
Also Lemmy: Step on me harder, Daddy Gaben!
Shit has some real Tesla-bro circa 2013 energy.
Look, despite Musk's PR, I never read a story about Musk like this:
In 2004, Wolpaw was diagnosed with ulcerative colitis. Expecting his condition to require a departure from the company, he spoke with managing director Gabe Newell, who surprised him by offering an extended leave with pay. "Your job is to get better," Newell said. "That is your job description at Valve. So go home to your wife and come back when you are better."
Gabe Newell isn't some kind of saint, but he does at least treat his employees like human beings, unlike Musk who famously berates his employees and treats them incredibly badly, especially if they have to (gasp!) miss work for any reason.
So while people shouldn't be praising Valve as some kind of panacea in the world, because they're still just a company, the reality is things like this have endeared Newell to the gaming community and made them believe he did care about a quality work environment.
A reminder, 2004 was before Wolpaw had written for multiple hit games from Valve. Portal came out in 2007 with Wolpaw as one half of the writing team. A few years later he would be head writer on Portal 2.
Those games would not have been the same if he had been let go from Valve when he was sick with ulcerative colitis.
Just a different perspective, I think it's unfair to compare Newell to a fucking slave drive apartheid fuckhead like Musk.
The problem is not Gabe. As far as i can tell, Gabe actually cares.
The problem is the CEO that comes after Gabe. Will your games still be available then?
Valve has been compared to Lord of the Flies because of its corporate structure by multiple people who worked for them. The company has an internal ranking system that determines compensation. It's also one of the least diverse workplaces in its industry, being overwhelmingly white and male.
https://www.pcgamer.com/valves-unusual-corporate-structure-causes-its-problems-report-suggests/
https://www.pcgamer.com/ex-valve-employee-describes-ruthless-industry-politics/
So, while I'm glad that Gabe was nice to one of his direct reports, the reality is that the president of the company being nice to one specific person doesn't make the company good or ethically ran.
I know right, its almost like the dumbass in charge at Tesla is a different person than the one in charge at Valve!
Gabe Newell has made some of the best games and Steam is the best platform for consumers, sure Epic Games is better for developers but it's not great to actually use as a consumer.
I don't see how they could make it any worst, Valve main product is a useless proprietary walled garden launcher that spy on its customers
Comment straight out of 2004.
True then; true now. People who asskiss Valve (and Gaben by extension) are victims of years of effective marketing. Valve is as greedy and duplicitous as any other corporation. You're just looking at it through rose colored glasses because it's the primary mechanism by which you access your hobby.
Did he/she lie? Steam is not even the least bad launcher. GOG offers DRM free games that don't even require a launcher.
Also don't forget that Valve probaly insane ammount of money with Microtransactions and Lootboxes and has essentially implemented NFTs into their games (without a blockchain) years before that word even existed.