Calls to reform UN Security Council after US vetoes Gaza ceasefire
Calls to reform UN Security Council after US vetoes Gaza ceasefire
Calls are growing for the UN Security Council to be reformed after the US became the only member to use its veto power to block a Gaza ceasefire resolution, a move welcomed by Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu. The UN chief says he will keep pushing for peace.
Which will be vetoed by all permanent members of the security council.
Yeah, this is something people don't quite understand. The UN primarily provides platform to initiate diplomatic discourse.
Even when there is demand to reform the UN to give it more power, most people will object because "'muh sovereignty".
If the UN was serious about promoting peace, they'd have occupied Gaza themselves over a decade ago.
This vote, like all votes, is political. It's not for some higher purpose
The problem in this case is depending on the security council to act on an issue it isn't designed to address.
The main purpose of the UN is to prevent global war, and the Security Council is the primary way in which that goal is achieved.
In that context, the P5's veto power makes sense. It prevents resolutions pitting the world against one of the superpowers that can sustain that kind of war.
How does the security counsel prevent global war? They're powerless to do anything to any of the super powers and by proxy also won't do anything to anyone else either.
That's the neat part! It doesn't!
Or the wonky intertwinement is the peace mechanism? How much more bloody would the world have been without it?
"Global War" isn't all war on the globe. It's war that pulls in the whole world. Having 4 of the P5 gang up on the 5th in a military campaign authorized by the UN would very likely result in WWIII.
The veto power prevents the UN from taking military action against a country the interest of countries that can sustain a war against the rest of the world.
American here, I support this call.
I mean, same. The ability of certain blocs to railroad the UN is obscene. We should protect our veto tho
We should protect our veto
The countries that currently have a veto make less sense the way the world is developing.
France and the UK have a veto, but Germany doesn't? China has a veto but India doesn't?
I get that it's based on historic disputes after the war, but it doesn't fit the current world well.
Our veto is the problem here. Vetoes in general are the problem.
So there were no "calls for reform" after a similar Russian veto about Artsakh in 2020 or recently. If nobody cares about that, then why should I care about anything else really.
There shouldn't be a security council
It's less a council of nations who actively keep the world secure, but moreso a council to keep the world secure from those nations. The security council is there so the world's most dangerous countries don't just go to war, and it makes them maintain a dialogue.
It's unfortunately functioning as needed. The vetoes may piss others off, but it keeps them at the table. The ability to veto anything is a great incentive to stick around.
How are they supposed to cater to the MIC if some random bunch of countries can cut off their markets like that?
Israel only exists in its current form because the advocate for the original UN plan was assassinated by a zionist terrorist. Israel was born an enemy of the UN.
How about we disband the Disunited Abominations?
We don't need UN.
This is far from perfect, even far from functional at times. But without it we don't have a forum. Without a forum, how do you deal with adversaries? It's not words... This UN is better than no UN
Things just dont make sense. Hamas, a very weak power, sneak attacks Israel, a relatively strong power, then hides amongst the civilian population with military targets scattered throughout neighborhoods and municipalities.
Is Hamas surprised by the mass civilian casualties or are you (the reader) the one who is surprised? Is Hamas actually weaponizing their civilians by showing the world how many are dying and being an agent of change in the UN?
Is Hamas considering these civilian deaths as martyrs? Because martyrdom is not the same as innocent death.
You’re god damn right I’m surprised.
If terrorists hid in your family’s basement and then your family home and all those in it, plus their whole neighborhood, was wiped off the face of the earth, you’d sing a real different tune then.
Try to imagine Palestinians as real people, instead of faceless terrorists who “sealed their fate” when they “supported the wrong side” (basically just by existing).
Picture a bank hostage situation. Police officer comes in with a fully loaded gun. A bank teller is being held at gunpoint by the robber. Never once in the history of ever has the police officer shot the bank teller.
That's what Israel is doing.
It’s more like the cops throw a grenade at the robber and teller, and when they kill the teller, the officers try to imply the teller’s complicity because they allowed the robbers to control the bank to begin with.
And then when the robbers rationalize the bank teller’s death as martyrdom for their cause, should we really feel bad for the teller?
No police in the world would say “ok, go free, and keep the hostages”. And by the way, a murderer would be better analogy than bank robber.
Also, hostages did die in real world hostage situations too, while police was targeting those hostage takers.
Thanks for clarifying for me. Didn't realize it was such a simple scenario like a bank robbery.
Why are you acting like Hamas and Israel are the only parties in the conflict? That makes no more sense than talking about a war between Palestine and Likud.
Pretending Hamas is the same as Palestinians is anti-Palestenian, which to any person with a moral compass is just as bad as antisemitism, the same as being hateful towards any ethnic group.
It's black and white thinking, just like the whole mindset of "the enemy of my enemy is my friend". Hamas and the Israeli regime are enemies. The people of Palestine and the Israeli regime are enemies, therefore Hamas and the people of Palestine must be friends. Also people opposing the actions of Israel must thus be friends with Hamas.
I'm just not sure how much of it is in bad faith because they support the evil actions (possibly even including the evil actions of Hamas that they believe gives justification for the evil actions of Israel), or because they are just stupid and don't understand that people fit into more than two categories.
Hamas wants dead civilians. That's how resistance/terrorism movements work (your choice of descriptor, it's the exact same thing).
IRA, Tamil Tigers, Viet Cong, etc. They all benefit from civilians on "their" side dying, that's just the game they are choosing to play. Acting like you're pwning somebody by pointing out an obvious fact won't get you far.
And for the record, fuck Hamas.
Hamas might be, but the millions of non-terrorist Palestinian's lives are worth more than to end as collateral damage.
Hamas is evil. Wanting to get rid of them is understandable. Commuting mass civilian death to remove them is still a war crime.
For decades we had the IRA and we didn't level Northern Ireland. The IRA were a terrorist organisation and repeatedly bombed civilians in UK.
What's surprising to me is that Hamas was able to succeed in the attack in the first place.
Also that people are actually starting to think for themselves and find nuance in a situation that is filled to the brim of it.
Hamas isn't surprised by the casualties, because the casualties are a desired goal for Hamas. They shot civilians who tried to flee south at the start of the war. They tell civilians to stand on the roofs of buildings that have been "knocked."
Mass death is their goal, because they know it will do shit like manipulate the UN into protecting them.
We could save so much money if we just disbanded the UN.
Th UN gives all countries the ability to have a voice on the world stage, yeah the security council can suck sometimes but not having the UN would be so much worse than having it
I understand this logic and I’ve made this argument in the past. As time goes on, however, I’m coming to the understanding that the major thing the UN actually provides is deniability. It creates an aura of accountability without actually accomplishing it. The pageantry of rhetoric around the UN’s mission would have us believe that merely shining light on the wrongdoing of powerful nations will lead to some kind of justice. It never does. It actually breeds complacency in the same way that ranting about politics online does. You feel like you are changing something, but you aren’t. I think we need something like the UN, but the UN as currently constructed is fatally flawed and may be making things actively worse in some important ways.
If only we had some global communication system that allowed people to post their opinions. Maybe a packet based one.
In the global scheme of things the UN is so fucking cheap. I can't understand your point at all.
Those parking spaces must be worth thousands of dollars!
Don't you think it would be possible to just operate it more cheaply?
Nothing changed on the UNSC when Russia vetoed the resolution to leave Ukraine.
I'm not educated enough to say which is a "worse" violation of the principles the UN stands for, but I'll go out on a limb and say nothing will change this time, either.
Yes, the whole idea of countries being able to veto UN resolutions are leading to exactly this, Russia vetoing all resolutions condemning their aggression in Ukraine and the US vetoing all resolutions concerning Israel.
I’m not sure how a resolution condemning anything is helpful, and I don’t know why Israel and Hamas need the UN for a cease fire.
Who's to say the call for reform is only motivated by the most recent ridiculous veto?
Russia wants to annex a country. Israel is fighting a terrorist group. Russia is worse.
Isreal has been slowly annexing bits of Palestine for decades. Those terrorists are the latest reaction to that.
Not that their violence against Israel is a good thing - far from it, but it's also not surprising.
Genocide is obviously worse than annexation. One just wants the land, the other wants to kill everyone on it too. Israel is far more evil than Russia.
That said nothing will change indeed.
Russia is committing genocide. They're both evil. Israel has been doing it for longer and is better at it.