Moderna's combo Covid and flu mRNA shot outperforms current vaccines in large trial

www.nbcnews.com

A combination shot would make it easier for people to get vaccinated against Covid and the flu at the same time.

Moderna’s combined Covid and flu shot outperformed the existing standalone vaccines for both viruses, according to the results of a phase 3 clinical trial published Wednesday in theJournal of the American Medical Association.

The vaccine uses the same messenger RNA technology as Moderna’s approved Covid vaccine.(There are no approved mRNA-based flu shots.)

The trial, funded by Moderna, included more than 8,000 adults ages 50 and older who were enrolled in October and November 2023. For people ages 50 to 64, the new vaccine was compared to Moderna’s Covid vaccine and the flu shot Fluarix. For people 65 and older, it was compared to the Covid vaccine and a different flu shot, called Fluzone, which is a stronger dose typically given to older adults. The trial participants either got the existing shots, or the new combination vaccine plus a placebo shot. (This way, both groups got two injections.)

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So... Whats this about covid shot causing heart problems? Propaganda or true?
I imagine having full COVID causes more heart and lung problems than the shot ever would.
- Yes.
  It has reportedly caused myocarditis in some people, and they generally recover.
  However:
  for every 100 000 vaccinated, compared to about four more cases of myocarditis we have 56 fewer hospitalizations, 13.8 admissions to intensive care and 0.6 fewer deaths.
  https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC9653149/

... unless you are in a country with a crazy antivaxxer at the helm of public health.
- Well, fortunately they don't get to dictate the health policies of advanced nations.
  
  That's what I'm most glad about.

I can’t wait. I love Vaccines. Science is truly amazing.
- The closest things to miracles we can actually do! Preserving probably millions of lives every year. It used to be normal to have a bunch of kids and just have many of them die or get crippled early in live due to child illness.
  Fun fact: in Vietnam, after they kicked out the French, they changed all the French street names with some exceptions. Pasteur was one of those exceptions.
- I know right? We need more comments like this to counter all the anti-vax bullshit.
  I'm not just neutral on vaccines, I think they're fucking amazing and I want more.
  
  I don't think we're going to find antivaxxers on Lemmy.
  
  “prole, you’ve had three flu shots! They’re for the daycare centre!”

“Immunologically, what’s happening in each cell is they’re acting as if they’ve been infected with both viruses, and so your immune system is going to respond and make the type of inflammation that you would if you had flu or Covid or both simultaneously,” he said.
This will 100% be taken out of context by anti-vaxx crowds.
- It's nothing new, though. Vaccines have always worked like this - make your body go through the motions without problematic invasive organisms.
- Nah those people think covid is the flu and isnt a big deal
- Terrible explanation as well.
  
  they should call it bivalent vaccine, since its 2 in 1.
  
  Is it? I understood it. How would you explain it?
- honestly so fucking what? let those jokers not get the vaccination. get sick, have permanent symptoms that last your whole life, fuck it, whatever.
  in the meantime, my sleeves are pre-rolled up for this shot, put it in my veins doc, I like not basically dying, its kind of a fetish
  
  I feel like we've had this discussion a billion times since 2019... Do you really still not understand herd immunity?
  
  Good luck getting it at all. One of those jokers is head of the HHS and is actively adding obstacles to vaccine approvals.
- No need to take it out of context. They hear the word "vaccine", smirk at the dumb sheep and shout AUTISM!!!111

Does this mean we're still getting a flu shot this year in the US? Last I heard RFK cancelled everything for them
- the current flu season is almost ending, i heard the next vaccine/season is around september

Not if the brain worms have anything to say about it

Totally gonna get it anyway but I'm not looking forward to my body throwing a 24h shitfit over it - I usually get what they call a VIGOROUS immune response from either one alone (not every year though, this last year's flu shot was actually 100% fine for some reason). One time I was an hour late on my Motrin-Tylenol rotation and the symptoms peaked 15 minutes or so after I got that delayed dose down and I just remember laying on my husband's lap and being so tired and fatigued and my bones were aching everywhere and I couldn't stop shivering and I must have just passed out because I remember suddenly waking up and feeling completely fine again. It's completely benign and controllable with over the counter medication (and undoubtedly better than catching the actual flu / COVID) but it suuucks.
- As I understand it, a good immune response is a positive thing with immunizations.
  
  Is it? All I've ever heard is that whether you're experiencing symptoms is completely irrelevant, which makes sense since the symptoms are triggered by the innate (non-specific) response and immunity is the adaptive (specific) response. Those are from what I've heard more or less completely independent.
- I'm in a similar place. The MRNA vaccines trigger a very strong immune response and I don't know if I want to go through it again. It sucks, and the non-mrna options offer at least comparable to slightly reduced protection. Which given my age is generally adequate

Side effects such as fever and chills were more common in people who got the new vaccine.
This caveat, glossed over in the article, is potentially a huge drawback.
Personally, the covid and flu shots by themselves make me feel icky but moderately functional for 24-36 hrs, but the time I had both at once I was practically bedridden for three days.
Obviously not everyone has this problem, but from what I've heard it's common enough that I worry if the two-in-one shot becomes the new standard it will turn a lot of folks off from vaccination altogether. There's enough vaccine hesitancy and skepticism out there already that a miserable reaction (or simply the need to clear your schedule for three whole days) could be enough to cause folks to indefinitely postpone their yearly booster or forgo vaccination altogether.
- I find the Moderna vaccine in general (covid only) makes me feel worse than the Pfizer one. No idea why, but making it worse won’t prevent me from getting vaccinated, I’ll just get separate vaccines.
  As long as people have choices, and they know what they are, it shouldn’t be a big deal. The problem will arise when people don’t know/have a choice and feel like crap when given the combo vax.
- only the og first covid made me feverish,achey, plus the pain from the vaccine. that lessened over time as you get more shots.
  
  Everyone reacts differently to different things. I know someone who's side effects were worse each Covid shot he got. He still got them, because he was taking care of an elderly family member, but he had to started planning to be bedridden himself. He's not antivax, but stopped getting boosters when the family member died because he didn't want to be laid up for a week at a time.
- Maybe try the vaccine from China. It does nothing
- This caveat, glossed over in the article, is potentially a huge drawback. I've known people who have been floored after just one of the vaccines. Though I wonder if the body reacts differently to the combined than two singles.
  
  i mean the MMR-v and tdap have been in use for decades, which are vaccines of multiple viruses, antigens as one.
  covid just illicit a stronger immune reaction, because of how newly humans encountered the coronavirus.

Oh HELL nooo! Not on Worm-Brain's watch!!

The trial, funded by Moderna
We did a trial which decided the governments around the world need to give us lots of money again and are releasing this information to drive up share price.
- What did you think was going to happen? Another company or university would graciously fund and conduct a trial of Moderna's product for no reason?
  If conducting a regulated clinical trial and having the results independently reviewed by government agencies in each market they seek to enter is not sufficient, I think you've already made up your mind.
  
  government agencies
  what government agencies?
- Trials are how drugs get approved and made. The article has a link to the study. If you disagree with the science, by all means, please elaborate.
  I understand you want to display cynicism towards both drug companies and governments. Would you prefer they not offer this vaccine for sale? Personally, I'd prefer just the one shot because I usually get both, but you do you.
- I'm no expert on drug trials, but I'm relatively sure they contract that shit out to competent firms.
  
  paid for by... Moderna.

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