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  • I honestly don't think this is true, I think it's the savior part that made it successful.

    Say you're a shitty person by stealing, lying, slept with married women and being a con man. If you can repent in your older years and all is forgiven by god, that releases the guilt.

    In my mind, guilt is the emotion of control for most major religions. If you give rules that if you break are super "wrong," but actually human nature (like sex), you will be able to control the masses. The religion alone can release the guilt that the religion made up.

    • That is a modern scenario where picking one's religion may not result in death. Go back just a little over 100 years and you're going to run into relgion not being an option one gets to make their own decisions about.

      • You're probably right. I was thinking about when Jesus was around and before where they seemed to have a choice for the most part. I actually wasn't thinking of modern times, but older ancient times since Judaism is the basic form for all Abrahamic religions and Jesus was Jewish.

        • assuming there was an actual jesus figure at all.

          • Absolutely true. I think they found a similar person in ancient Jewish texts that could be him, hard to say.

        • For many Romans it was less effort than Roman gods required. There were some other benefits but really it was Constantine that got Christianity from a million followers to the dominant religion of the Mediterranean and Europe. Then shortly after that the church got power hungry and the really bad stuff started happening and no one on the outside was safe. About 400 years give or take.

    • I am certainly no historian, but even I know that for thousands of years there have been many atrocities made in the name of religion.

      1. Christianity’s own parable of the crucifixion of Jesus of Nazareth
      2. The 100-year war
      3. Assimilation of Pagan rituals and values into Christianity as a means to encourage Pagans to become Christians
      4. Indulgences being sold by the Catholic Church
      5. The current war between Israel and Palestine
      6. The reversal of Roe v Wade (abortion rights) that now allows laws being passed that make even natural miscarriages illegal and potentially punishable by death
      7. Clergy (not just Catholic) who abuse children, and the institutions enabling said abuse by covering up the abuses
      8. The people behind He Gets Us

      Religion is a pandemic that has held back humanity from achieving their potential.

      • You forgot about the Defenestration of Prague.

      • I'm not fighting with you, I agree with all of that. I just think the core of how people stay in religion and proselytize from their own free will, are guilt and forgiveness. There are ups and downs for every culture, religion, country. Also, anything that develops power gets taken over by the greeds, and all of the things you've mentioned are a result of that.

        • I'm not fighting with you, I agree with all of that.

          Samsies. I apologize if my post sounded aggressive.

          • No worries, this whole thread is a surprisingly pleasant conversation about religion. It's a surprise.

    • see also Pure Land Buddishm

    • Humans are a herd animal. It is in our genetics, our genes, our nature, to follow a pack leader. Religion was the method of establishing this pack leader well before we had any notion of 'nation' or 'statehood' or 'ethnic identity'. All religions are founded in their basic concept based on this natural human herd instinct. And like any herd, the leadership is always determined by some violent confrontation between leadership contenders to determine which person will be the alpha, or dominant, leader. Unfortunately, humans tend to forget that we are animals in our nature, and behave just like all other animals, except that we are just a bit more intelligent than many other species and a lot more aggressively competitive.

      So with this in mind, humans were bound by nature to have religion, and to be lead by a religious leader (before we invented statehood, after the Peace of Westphalia). Basically, the only choice humans had was 'what religion'? it is a matter of which religion was the most aggressive, and after that factor, the most appealing. The 'savior' part made it 'appealing', but 'aggression' was still the major factor. Christianly may have been appealing before Constantine, but it was not aggressive until he brought the military power of the Roman Empire behind it.

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constantine_the_Great_and_Christianity

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peace_of_Westphalia

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